Portable generator

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markrmarkr
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Post by markrmarkr » Tue, 20 Jan 2015, 12:20

I tried playing with the eco switch. It made no difference at 10A. On or off it still worked fine.

With eco off at 15A it started with the gen running at full speed, but once I plugged in the EVSE noise increased and it quickly bogged, before tripping the overload.

With eco on at 15A it starts at low rpm and low noise. I plug in the EVSE and rpm and noise pick up, then rpm drops and overload trips.


I've only run the generator for just over an hour so far. Do you think it's performance will improve once it's broken-in?

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Post by T1 Terry » Wed, 21 Jan 2015, 01:17

markrmarkr wrote: Thanks for all your input, but I'm not quite ready to face reality yet.

I'm thinking of taking the air-cleaner off, and taking the muffler off, and maybe even giving it a wif of Nitrous Oxide (no that won't work - it takes hours to get a reasonable charge, and Nitrous Oxide is expensive, but you get the idea).

The engine seems to bog down before it trips to overload. So I'm thinking that if I can give it some help, and stop the bogging, the the rpm will stay high under load, and it'll meet the power output requirements.

It's such a nice little generator. With a bit of ingenuity, I can actually get it into the back of my Leaf, where it fits snugly. - I can't just give up on it.
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Post by offgridQLD » Wed, 21 Jan 2015, 01:29

"With eco off at 15A it started with the gen running at full speed, but once I plugged in the EVSE noise increased and it quickly bogged, before tripping the overload."

My guess would be the overload is selected to be just befor the motor struggles to turn the generator at a fast enough speed and stalls.

Like I said befor there is a reason why genuine 8kva generator has a 1000cc 3cy diesel motor and not a 250cc petrol motor.

Trying to power a electrical load that's larger then the ICE motors mechanical output power never works.


DO you really want a little petrol motor revving its guts out beyond its capability's (overriding governors or other modifications) The evse isn't just a spike load that you need to overcome it's a continuous load for hrs on end.

Why not just keep it as a 10A single charging generator if your happy with it rather than killing it.

Kurt
Last edited by offgridQLD on Tue, 20 Jan 2015, 14:31, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by T1 Terry » Wed, 21 Jan 2015, 01:48

No idea what happened to the rest of the post, only the quote appeared. Basically, try restricting the air feed to the cooling fan with gaffer tape and see if that is enough additional power to stop it bogging down, just don't run it too long like that. If that works, try building a more permanent air restriction but add a water mist spray to the air being drawn in to both the cooling air and the carburettor, water will carry 3 times the heat energy of air so the reduced load on the cooling fan yet still enough cooling capacity could be all the extra power you need. Another way of reducing the load is to remove every second blade in the cooling fan, but this would of course void any possibility of returning the unit for a refund. There are many engine modification you could do to improve the engines power, depends just how far you want to go with making it do the job you want it to do.

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Post by acmotor » Wed, 21 Jan 2015, 06:16

+1 what Kurt said. Settle for 10A charging.

I don't think there will be significant change if the motor is run in.
Truth is that most small gens lose power with use not gain it.

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Post by T1 Terry » Wed, 21 Jan 2015, 14:37

You could also supercharge the little engine using an airpump from a '70 model jap 4 cyl and belt drive it, the drive ratio can be adjusted to match the boost you need to achieve the required power output.

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Post by reglissenoir » Thu, 29 Jan 2015, 08:51

hello everybody

I was able to charge my I-miev with a mcCulloch fdd210 (2kw 120v 60hz) for over 2 hours without problem I just shorted the ground and common, I would really be interested to know if somebody tried to hard wire the onboard charger to be able to charge wile driving before I unsealed the charger and try it my self!!!

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Post by acmotor » Sat, 28 Feb 2015, 07:28

Good test there.

The iMiEV at 120V will still draw 10A on standard EVSE so 1.2kW charging. However that is a slow rate. Some 14 hours for a full charge. A hour's charge might get you home though.

The IMiEV at 230V ( Australian EVSE and local power ) draws 10A (9.4A) so around 2.2 kW thus the need for a higher powered 230V generator than the 2kW 120V unit reglissenoir tested.

Charging should be fine off a 2kW 120V generator as you have tested.
However the EVSE supplied with Australian iMiEVs won't go down to 120V in my tests.
The USA and Canada ? EVSEs are able to go down to something like 90 V ?
Possibly there is no difference in the on-board charger itself ?

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Post by Gabz » Sat, 28 Feb 2015, 14:06

acmotor wrote: Possibly there is no difference in the on-board charger itself ?


I did ask this question to one of the Mitsubishi reps who gave a talk at the local engineers Australia thing years ago and he said yes same on board charger across the world.
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Post by reglissenoir » Sat, 28 Feb 2015, 14:22

Yes it is the same, I can charge 120v 13amp or 240v 18amp.

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Post by acmotor » Sat, 28 Feb 2015, 21:17

reglissenoir, what year / model iMIEV do you have ?
Do you have an EVSE 'brick' in line or a charge cable direct to vehicle ?
If EVSE, is it standard mitsubishi or modified ?

You mean 120V 13A or 240V 13A (not 18A) ? The charger being limited to 3.3kW so at 240V the current would be about 13A.
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Post by reglissenoir » Sun, 01 Mar 2015, 12:46

it's a 2014 and there is only one model now (basic one)you right 240v 13amp, my connecttion is 18 amp max .

I bought a modified 120\240v evse form evse upgrade


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Post by reecho » Sun, 15 Mar 2015, 00:09

After picking up a 3KVA genset from a local supplier for my brother and setting it up, I thought a good test would be to connect my 2010 for a quick load check. Worked a charm with no mods whatsoever. Nice gradual load once connected too. Good stuff.

May look at something like this but i need about 6kva for around 50% duty.

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Post by photomac » Sun, 15 Mar 2015, 15:02

August 4th, 2013 I asked the question of this portable generator. Mainly to research the feesibilty of getting to Augusta from Perth. Bed and breakfasts were an option but …
March 7th, 2015, at the very busy Electrichana, parked next to the RACWA LEAF in my RaVOLT, a LEAF purchased Nov 2013, RAC are hopeful a fast recharge 'highway' could be finished by July but October definitely.
They hopeful that once proven other business will see the benefit and pick up the batton.
Perhaps other states' road car clubs might follow?

http://rac.com.au/news-community/enviro ... c-vehicles
The map is clickable, Nannup and Bridgetown will happen after. Thank you RACWA

[Edit by Coulomb: repaired URL, now clickable]
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Post by T1 Terry » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 00:14

reecho wrote: After picking up a 3KVA genset from a local supplier for my brother and setting it up, I thought a good test would be to connect my 2010 for a quick load check. Worked a charm with no mods whatsoever. Nice gradual load once connected too. Good stuff.

May look at something like this but i need about 6kva for around 50% duty.

Blue Diamond Generator

How noisy was it at full load? Do you think the unit would not handle the full load for very long, is that why you would look at a unit twice the capacity?

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Post by acmotor » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 01:01

Mmmm, thinking open frame noisy genset of 54kg charging EV at only 2.2kW. Quite capable with 7HP motor but not the best choice ?

Did you per chance test the earth-neutral for connection on this gen set ? some have it connected and the add suggests some models have RCD built in. I note the Oz standards for use of gen sets require user to be in control of the earth connection so RCDs can function, either by built in RCD or an external RCD, here I guess an earth leakage checking EVSE is acceptable (but you don't run EVSE on 2010 ?). Still, the earth to neutral connection must be made at some point to comply and not just left to chance.
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Post by reecho » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 16:00

No noisier that the average open frame 3kva set such as Dunlite. Far bit more than a silenced inverter equivalent.

Didn't check the earth neutral connection. It was charging the Miev at around 2950W.

I wouldn't be happy running it at that sustained load......no.

50% duty for me if I get something.
Last edited by reecho on Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 05:03, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by acmotor » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 18:21

How did you measure the 2950W ?
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Post by reecho » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 18:54


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Post by acmotor » Mon, 16 Mar 2015, 21:29

What does your i draw off mains power ?    A and W

Edit: typo
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Post by reecho » Tue, 17 Mar 2015, 02:39

13 amps.......or thereabouts....

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Post by Adverse Effects » Tue, 17 Mar 2015, 02:51

Image you could go to Aldi and buy there "quality" unit

3000W PORTABLE GENERATOR

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Post by reecho » Tue, 17 Mar 2015, 06:09

I could if they were in WA..... Image

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Post by acmotor » Tue, 17 Mar 2015, 06:34

Reecho, I find the iMiEV draws a constant current set by J1772 so yes, around 13A makes sense as the top current.
I think I and others measure 13.75A ?
But that had me wondering with your 2950W measurement...
13.75A at 240V is   3300W, the max rated iMiEV charge
You measured 2950W so the gen was supplying 2950/13.75 = 214V so the gen was sagging a bit. Your comment about wishing to have a higher rated gen is probably justified.
It would be interesting to view the waveform on a scope.

Hey, the Aldi gen is probably quite good for the price. Though you get what you pay for rule may come in.
The 7HP motor is a good sign. Though this is probably at 3600 RPM (60Hz), less at 3000RPM (50Hz)
Note here, this is like the Blue Diamond Gen that re echo tested. It is a 3000RPM non inverter type whose output will sag as the load increases around and past the rated load, unlike the inverter type where voltage is generally constant and shuts down if the load exceeds what the gen is rated at. At least on the units I have tested.
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