MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

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dRdoS7
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MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by dRdoS7 »

Hi,

I noticed that they've added a slightly larger MAX 48V to the range.

https://www.mppsolar.com/v3/pip-max/

Wonder if they have corrected any of the bugs? Or, introduced new ones.

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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by Revlac »

Not sure about the bugs either, but for off grid use and the addition of some separate charge controllers it should do the job well.
This size inverter is better suited to a family home where there could be many appliances running at the same time, not have to bother with load shedding/sharing.
I expect idle consumption to be less than a pair of 4048's in parallel.
Not much known about these MAX series yet.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by coulomb »

dRdoS7 wrote: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 06:02 Wonder if they have corrected any of the bugs?
I can confirm that the main premature float bug is still faithfully and firmly in place. They really believe in that thing.
Or, introduced new ones.
That's much harder to tell.

On the one hand, any version one product tends to have more bugs. On the other hand, it seems largely a matter of modifying an existing design, mainly just making things bigger, so the chances seem reasonable that it will work much the same as existing models.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by ojeysky »

coulomb wrote: Thu, 29 Oct 2020, 05:36
dRdoS7 wrote: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 06:02 Wonder if they have corrected any of the bugs?
I can confirm that the main premature float bug is still faithfully and firmly in place. They really believe in that thing.
This is just so unfortunate, it's not clear why MPP have decided not to fix this. Is there any high Voc hybrid out that that does not have a float bug?
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by coulomb »

ojeysky wrote: Fri, 06 Nov 2020, 04:33it's not clear why MPP have decided not to fix this. Is there any high Voc hybrid out that that does not have a float bug?
No, not one model I know of manufactured by Voltronic Power (so the PIP, Axpert etc models) is free of the bug. Even when the bug is in a completely different place in the firmware, it's always present. It's almost as if it's a corporate policy or something.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by saviothecnic »

I was also looking at this inverter
Since my Clone PIP-MK4850
often goes into ByPass due to overload

Can you explain to me what this float bug is?

Do you know if this model is sold in Europe
with shipping in Italy and by whom
i would not pay too much for shipping and customs
for this i prefer shipping from europe?

This model compared to the MK series working in high voltage
PV side can also work without batteries
and also miscelfare PV and Utility exactly what the MK series
does not do I understand correctly

Thanks
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by coulomb »

saviothecnic wrote: Thu, 26 Nov 2020, 15:31 Can you explain to me what this float bug is?
When charging the battery from an intermittent source (e.g. solar on a cloudy day), it misinterprets low charge current as the battery being full. The battery is actually full when two conditions are satisfied: the charge current is low, and the battery voltage is high, near the absorb/bulk voltage setting. They check that it is near the float voltage setting. So what happens is that a third of the way through the charge (say), the battery voltage is near the float voltage, 2/3 of the charge left to go. Along comes a cloud, the battery charge current drops below a threshold, and the inverter says "Oh look! The battery must be full because the charge current is low!". In fact, the charge current is low because there is a cloud, and because of this cloud, it should be charging even longer, not stopping now.
Do you know if this model is sold in Europe
with shipping in Italy and by whom
No, I know nothing of availability in Europe. My understanding is that there should be resellers based in Europe, who would have stock in Europe.
This model compared to the MK series working in high voltage
PV side can also work without batteries
Yes, for reasons unclear to me, only the high voltage SCC models can run batteryless.
and also miscelfare PV and Utility exactly what the MK series does not do I understand correctly
Sorry, I don't understand this.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by saviothecnic »

coulomb wrote: Thu, 26 Nov 2020, 19:44
and also miscelfare PV and Utility exactly what the MK series does not do I understand correctly
Sorry, I don't understand this.
Sorry if it's misspelled
I'm Italian and I use google translator

I meant the MAX series can take power
from utility and photovoltaic together?

Example if I have 3000W load and 2000W of photovoltaics
inverter takes 2000W from Fotovotlaico and 1000W from utility
or blend?
because the MK series does not do this at least so I understand
in that case he would use 3000W everything from utility he would use
photovoltaic only if it has equal or lower power than photovoltaic production
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by Tejota »

saviothecnic wrote: Thu, 26 Nov 2020, 22:11
I'm Italian and I use google translator

Italian reseller: You can purchase MAX from Antonio Bataglia shop. google Primo Axpert MAX 7200-48 cercastock.it

I have this inverter since August. Full review on spanish forum


Conclusion: Plenty of bugs at initial firmware 45.01. Voltronic in 3 months has released many update firmwares to this model. Jump to 45.xx to 90.xx number firmware, so I think they have rebuild full firmware because 45.xx was unstable (F55 error everytime on SBU and SCC on).

On SUB and SCC on, too many active power feed on grid (2kW peak) with 7kWp field solar installed.

Voltronic should improve much more the firmware of this model.

Regards.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by dRdoS7 »

Hi,
saviothecnic wrote: Thu, 26 Nov 2020, 15:31 I was also looking at this inverter

Do you know if this model is sold in Europe
with shipping in Italy and by whom
i would not pay too much for shipping and customs
for this i prefer shipping from europe?
Not Europe, but MPP Solar have a store on Alibaba. For me, in Australia, it works out a bit cheaper (I asked for a shipping quote in Sept.) than buying from the Aust. seller, or from MPP Solar's ebay store. It would take no more than 2 weeks to get here from Taiwan.

Just checked: there is also a 7248MAX that ships from Europe.

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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by saviothecnic »

Yes, but I do not see the PIP MAX 8048 model available from anyone, perhaps it is too new and we will have to wait a little longer
Only one seller on Ebay has it but it is outside Europe
and too many Customs fees and expensive shipping for me
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

Hello everyone,

after a few years of having just ongrid inverters (Solax 3.6k and Solis 3.6), I decided to add a new invertor to my house (3 different families on the same energy meter), this time a OFFGRID inverter, battery is still work in progress.

I chosed MPP Solar 8048 MAX, purchased from a seller in my country, it was brand new in box, just received from Taiwan and directly shipped to me. After instaling a new string of 10 Trina Solar 370 mono half-cut panels, I tried the inverter, without a battery connected, as this was one of the new features, of the MAX series, it works without a battery.

I installed it in an cloudy saturday, when I powered it on I was happy to see it produces ~700w .. but the happiness faded away in the evening, it was even more cloudy and the sun just set, the inverter was still producing ~700w, now I was a little worried, even if the new string was WEST facing, it couldn't produce that much on those conditions, the SOUTH string on the ongrid inverter was almost producing 50w (from 2kwp). Later when the sky was black, I checked the inverter and surprise .. still producing 700w, the PV1 string still had 203v :( I removed the DC connectors , and it was the same, even without connectors plugged in. Next day I checked the PV2 connectors, on those connectors I always had 0v :( I also tried to plug in my EST and SOUTH strings, the same, on PV1 always ~205v and on PV2 always 0v, with or without DC cables plugged in.

Sent it back and the seller replaced the SPS board, this fixed the problem and sent it back to me in the same week, happily I installed it back and enjoyed the evening photovoltaic production (WEST string) for a full week, only one week it worked as expected, and the inverter broke again, exactly like it was when I received it, the PV1 input stuck at 2600w, and the fans at maximum speed (I think, because they ware so loud) all the night long the inverter fans ware at maximum speed, and the inverter was thinking it still producing 2600w from the WEST string :(

Now I'm waiting for the seller to replace the MPPT board too and hopefully this will solve the problem.

PS. On this forum I can't attach/upload images ?
PS. If my posts is better suited in the REPAIR thread, please move it

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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by weber »

sibianul wrote: Tue, 11 May 2021, 00:28 PS. On this forum I can't attach/upload images ?
Welcome to the forum, and thanks for your post. It is an antispam measure that you cannot upload images or other attachments to your first post only. You should be able to do so now. If not, try logging out from the forum and logging back in again.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by coulomb »

sibianul wrote: Tue, 11 May 2021, 00:28 Sent it back and the seller replaced the SPS board, this fixed the problem...
It seems odd that they replaced the switch mode power supply, if that's what they did. The power supply isn't a separate board in 5kVA models.

Not much is known about these models, as they are still fairly new. Good luck with the repairs.

If you are interested in the technical internals, see the topic on a Spanish forum Tejota linked to above; use your browser's translation facility. He has done a lot of work on the 7.2kW model, which is a precursor to the 8kW model.
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021. Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.
If you appreciate my work, you can buy me a coffee.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

When I initially notice something is wrong with the inverter, I asked the seller if there is anything else I can check before sending it back. He told that if I want, I can open it up and check if the cables around MPPT board are all plugged in correctly, and if visually there is nothing wrong, I should send it back to them. As I was curious to see the inside, I opened it up right away, all the connectors ware glued on the boards, there wasn't anything lose, also there wasn't anything burned, everything looked ok, but I just removed the main cover, I haven't disconnected any board.

I also started an ticket directly with MPP Solar, with the seller in CC, Andy from MPP solar was very quick with it's response, everytime, he also sent me the dissasembly manual (I think it's the same as 7.2k), and I asked for the communication protocol for the 8048 MAX, as I want to connect using an arduino module to the invertor, so I have all the stats in my home dashboard.

I wanted to upload a photo, with the board the seller told me he replaced, as I made photos of all the boards I seen when I dissasembled, but still can't upload, maybe after a few more posts :)
coulomb wrote: Tue, 11 May 2021, 08:03 It seems odd that they replaced the switch mode power supply, if that's what they did. The power supply isn't a separate board in 5kVA models.
The SPS board is placed over the MPPT board, and it's much smaller than the MPPT board.. I will try to upload a photo after a few more posts :)
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Also I find a very stupid design to have a metal sheet so close to the AC screws, even with the insulated screwdrivers, you still can touch the metal sheet (connected to GND) when trying to tighten the Line wire
mpp solar weird design.jpg
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

I received my inverter back, and it seems the repetitive issue I had was because an connector on the MPPT board, the connector was glued, but it was not fully inserted when glued. When I sent it the first time, the seller verified it and replaced the SPS board, when he removed he also checked the connectors, as they ware glued he believed it was all ok, but maybe when he touched the connectors, he bearly moved it enough to make a good contact, for the moment, after mounting a new SPS board, he noticed it works, but the problem was not related to the SPS board, but to the connector he touched a little bit.

Now when I sent it the second time, he wanted to replace the MPPT board, and when checking the connector better he noticed it was not properly inserted. He now mounted the original SPS board, that he replaced previous time, and it's working just fine.

hopefully I will have it working for many years from now, I'm almost finished with my battery project, can't wait to test the invertor charger, to see if everything works as expected
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by data »

Are you happy with your 8048MAX now?
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

Yes, so far I'm happy but it needs to last at least a few years to pay for itself.

I'm a little concerned regarding the internal temperature, when the inverter is converting Solar energy to AC output, it seems it gets quite hot after continous multi-hours 2000 - 3000w AC power output. I don't know if it's normal or not, but as I monitor the inverter, and also the ANT BMS I have graphs of almost all values, bellow I will post a few images.

The inverter is in my garage, yesterday and today it was quite hot outside too, ~32degrees C, in my garage I estimate the temperature was 25 - 26 degrees.

It doesn't get hot when charging the battery from solar, only when converting from PV to AC output.

But so far I only connected 10 Trina Solar 370w half-cut panels, so only 3.7kwp. I plan to mount on PV2 my other strings which now are generating energy trough Ongrid inverters. How hot will it be after connecting other strings too ?

MPP Solar inverter has an WEST orientated string connected to PV1, I plan to mount in parallel 2 other strings, on PV2, one orientated to the EAST side, one to the SOUTH, each string has 7 x 290w panels.

Anyone knows if there is setting I can make, to force the inverter to charge from the grid when is set to SUB mode ? I can only charge from the grid (where my ongrid inverters inject energy) if I set it on USB mode.

PS> The inverter was set in SBU mode all night long, but from ~7:30 in the morning it switched to grid as the battery went low, after powering it 2 nights in a row. We are using quite alot energy daily, about 25 - 35kwh, yesterday it was 25kwh. Today I think it delivered more than 35kwh, mostly from solar and battery, but for sure ~5kwh from the national grid
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inverter temperature.jpg
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MPP Inverter - WEST INVErter.jpg
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

here is the graph with the AC output power
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mpp solar 8048 max AC active power.jpg
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

And here some numbers while discharging the battery at a 90A rate. Regarding this , it seems the ANT BMS is reporting 98A and MPP solar only 90A.

I'm suspecting ANT BMS is wrong, as I haven't made any calibration to it, but I don't know how to check.
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mpp Solar 8048 90A discharge current.jpg
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MNPP Solar 8048 MAX efficiency when drawing 90A from li-ion battery.jpg
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by catalincre »

I bet you have the fans oriented downward. Greetings from Sibiu county.
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

Salut Catalin :)

Yes, the fans are as MPP Solar mounted them, I have not yet inverted the fans, yesterday I wrote to Andy from MPP Solar, and I'm curious what does he suggests regarding the temperature
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by ojeysky »

sibianul wrote: Fri, 25 Jun 2021, 00:00 Yes, so far I'm happy but it needs to last at least a few years to pay for itself.

I'm a little concerned regarding the internal temperature, when the inverter is converting Solar energy to AC output, it seems it gets quite hot after continous multi-hours 2000 - 3000w AC power output. I don't know if it's normal or not, but as I monitor the inverter, and also the ANT BMS I have graphs of almost all values, bellow I will post a few images.

The inverter is in my garage, yesterday and today it was quite hot outside too, ~32degrees C, in my garage I estimate the temperature was 25 - 26 degrees.

It doesn't get hot when charging the battery from solar, only when converting from PV to AC output.

But so far I only connected 10 Trina Solar 370w half-cut panels, so only 3.7kwp. I plan to mount on PV2 my other strings which now are generating energy trough Ongrid inverters. How hot will it be after connecting other strings too ?

MPP Solar inverter has an WEST orientated string connected to PV1, I plan to mount in parallel 2 other strings, on PV2, one orientated to the EAST side, one to the SOUTH, each string has 7 x 290w panels.

Anyone knows if there is setting I can make, to force the inverter to charge from the grid when is set to SUB mode ? I can only charge from the grid (where my ongrid inverters inject energy) if I set it on USB mode.

PS> The inverter was set in SBU mode all night long, but from ~7:30 in the morning it switched to grid as the battery went low, after powering it 2 nights in a row. We are using quite alot energy daily, about 25 - 35kwh, yesterday it was 25kwh. Today I think it delivered more than 35kwh, mostly from solar and battery, but for sure ~5kwh from the national grid
How are you getting data from ANT BMS for graphing?
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by sibianul »

I uploaded the code I use on my RaspberryPi Zero, to get the data from Ant BMS, on this forum

In the mean time I made a few more modifications to my dashboards, now I have even more information's, and also the data I get from MPP Solar inverter is shown better in the dashboard.
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dashboard animation.gif
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Re: MPP SOLAR PIP-8048MAX

Post by energya »

Salut @sibianul ,

Did you managed to fix the heating issues?
How happy are you with the inverter after this time?
I am using the same one for a few months (initially as an UPS) and recently installed two Solar Panels strings (Qcell) for a total of 6390W power peak.
What firmware version is running your device? Mine is on 46.04.
I am curious if you tried to use that "voltronic" container to read data from it using the USB/RS232 and send data over MQTT to HASS. I've managed to read most of the data via USB using "QPIRI=109" and "QPIWS-40", but I am not able to read the PV_in_watts. (hopefully I am not too offtopic for this forum)
Really appreciate your posts on multiple forums/sites.
Cheers!
Salutari din Ro :)
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