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Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Wed, 21 Oct 2020, 15:28
by justin288
vanzelstt wrote: Sat, 16 May 2020, 18:01 Just installed my 2 x PIP-5048MK in parallel. seem to be working great. They are running Firmware 71.90. Don't know if that means that the for-mentioned issues have been addressed? Can connect via bluetooth but not via serial?. using the same USB to serial as my old 4048. i get an ack when using Tera term so thinking that it might be Watchpower 1.13SP3?
How did you resolve this connection issue, i have same issue and mine is also running Firmware 71.90 and 02.40 for the display.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Wed, 21 Oct 2020, 16:56
by coulomb
justin288 wrote: Tue, 20 Oct 2020, 17:02=
After Paralleling with AC Grid Input, when the AC Grid Supply goes out, will it affect the Inverters when it the AC Grid Supply restored? Will the inverters remain in Parallel state?
Yes, the inverters parallel with themselves, but not the grid (unless in bypass mode [ edit: and then, the inverters will be running in reverse to charge the battery if needed ]). When the grid comes back, the inverters will synchronise to it, ready to switch the load cleanly to the grid if needed. The inverters will stay paralleled unless something drastic happens.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Thu, 22 Oct 2020, 21:52
by affer
coulomb wrote: Tue, 29 Sep 2020, 10:35 Following this post, I've been prompted to check if the QED, QEM, QEY, QET etc commands are present in the later removable display firmwares. These commands query the PV and load energy for the present day, month, year, and grand total. The QEx commands seem to report PV generated energy; the QLx commands seem to report the load (AC-out) energy.

In fact these commands are present now, from removable display version 02.40 (and perhaps earlier, but they are not present in version 02.00).

I have not found documentation for these. The infini protocol document has the QEx commands, but not the QLx commands, and also they QE[x] commands have a nnn field not present in the PIP/Axpert versions. So I'll attempt to document them here.

QEDyyyymmdd: Query PV Energy for the given day. yyyy must be the current year, mm must be the current month, and dd must be no later than the current day. Example: "QED20200929" without the quotes but with the 2 usual CRC characters and a carriage return for the PV energy generated on 2020/Sep/29. Result example "(00000123" for 123 Wh. There are always 8 digits after the '('. The result will also have the usual 2 CRC characters and carriage return and no quotes.
QEMyyyymm: Query PV Energy for the given month. yyyy must be the current year. Same result format as QED.
QEYyyyy: Query PV energy for the given year. There is storage for a few years, possibly restricted to 2017-2026. Result is in watt·hours, but the least significant two digits will always be zero (the firmware stores the energy internally in hundreds of Wh, and multiplies by 100 to display the result in Wh).
QET: Query total PV energy grand total since switch-on.
QLD, QLM, QLY, QLT: same as for the QEx commands, but reports load energy instead of PV energy.

i can get a reply on QLD
size : 6
1 04 00305 0016800 00353 03442 0112.5 1862.9 2846.1 00053

which correspond with my total output (not PV produced)
3442 is today (3.4Kwh)
0112.5 monthly
1862.9 yearly
2846.1 total

the others i cant get any reply on! but interesting :-) maybe i should try to update my display firmware.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Fri, 23 Oct 2020, 18:15
by affer
i can see according to this video that the growatt battery is in fact two pylontech batteries in parallel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXz5rJF ... e=youtu.be

to my information that is not the case anymore, but do anyone know if the 5048MK can be interfaced with growatt batteries? and use the PYL setting in the 5048MK

the model in question: http://ginverter.com/Residential-Storag ... 3-635.html



thanks.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sat, 24 Oct 2020, 09:13
by coulomb
affer wrote: Fri, 23 Oct 2020, 18:15 to my information that is not the case anymore,
Indeed. The 51.2 V nominal voltage, and maximum voltage of 57.6 V strongly indicate 16S configuration (16 cells in series). All Pylontechs, as far as I know, are 15S.
but do anyone know if the 5048MK can be interfaced with growatt batteries? and use the PYL setting in the 5048MK
If they use the Pylontech protocol, it should work. The Pylontech protocol is fairly well known and supported.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sat, 24 Oct 2020, 09:15
by coulomb
affer wrote: Fri, 23 Oct 2020, 18:15 i can see according to this video that the growatt battery is in fact two pylontech batteries in parallel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXz5rJF ... e=youtu.be
Scary that they didn't even parallel the two Pylontechs properly.

Edit: see here: https://youtu.be/OXz5rJFGbvE?t=62

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 16:12
by executivul
I did some tests with my PIP-5048MK, display fw 2.49
The conclusions are:

1. BAD!!! The display doesn't check for proper CRC in the received commands, not only the Q(uestion) commands but also the set commands, I used something like MUCHGC00212, MUCHGC01012, PSPB112, etc and always got (ACK<CRC> as a response even if using "12" as CRC, you want to be careful of what you are sending the PIP's way or you might change whatever option which you don't want to change.

2. GOOD! The 2.49fw has the QED/QEM commands and reports the production totals

3. GOOD! The MK/AxpertKing can be controlled just by POPLG00/POPLG02 if bypass is enabled (display option 23).
POPLG00 sets it to automatic mode (option 10=AUTO), inverter/dual conversion enabled, using the configured output priority(SBU/SUB/USB opt 01), bypass on overload.
POPLG02 switches to ECO/bypass mode, inverter disabled, loads powered by grid with bypass relay engaged, same as turning off via button, lower power consumption of the inverter, but SCC enabled and AC charger enabled if allowed by opt 16, exactly what we want for a low bat case.

A very simple automation will be like: SOC>55% POPLG00, SOC<22% POPLG02, never touching the SBU, SBL Ucb, 2A utility charge, etc

That's all folks! :D

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 19:12
by affer
executivul wrote: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 16:12
A very simple automation will be like: SOC>55% POPLG00, SOC<22% POPLG02, never touching the SBU, SBL Ucb, 2A utility charge, etc

That's all folks! :D
i use solpiplog for that on my 5048mk. https://github.com/njfaria/SolPipLog

depending on battery voltage, i use below flochart:

The Victron BMV is work in progress, one day i hope i can use precise SoC

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Mon, 26 Oct 2020, 08:15
by paulvk
I am using these for SOC from ebay they have other features I am not using yet like , over and under current and voltage relay outputs and they use a hall sensor for current measurement so no voltage drop as with a shunt , being wireless they are also very portable, but I have two versions one has no temperature sensor do not get this one get the one with temperature sensor its wireless link is much better note also you can replace the provided NRF24 wireless units for long range units.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Mon, 26 Oct 2020, 08:22
by coulomb
executivul wrote: Sun, 25 Oct 2020, 16:12 I did some tests with my PIP-5048MK, display fw 2.49

1. BAD!!! The display doesn't check for proper CRC in the received commands, not only the Q(uestion) commands but also the set commands...
I wondered about where the CRC got checked. Upon further reading, it seems that they haven't bothered to check the CRC since at version 02.00 at the latest. That's pretty slack, but it's not something new in removable display firmware version 02.49. It would be pretty easy to add: at the top of the parsing function, check for a carriage return in the first say 12 characters of the buffer. If not found, NAK. If found, rewind two characters and check the CRC with one new function. They already have the CRC calculating function.

I think I even noticed a few places where they didn't check for the carriage return in the appropriate position (variable length commands so not at a fixed position), so not even the total command length is checked. That's just sloppy. But again, I don't think many if any of those are new to 02.49.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Mon, 26 Oct 2020, 15:56
by executivul
@coulomb I am sending and checking the proper CRC every time from my Arduino, just when using the console I found out the bug.

I'm afraid that a communication error might corrupt a command, eg POP00 to POP02, one bit difference.
I do get CRC errors sometimes, when requiring QPIGS, like 1 in 1000 responses.
If the PIP checked the CRCs then I would be more confident that my commands are received correctly.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 27 Oct 2020, 07:40
by coulomb
executivul wrote: Mon, 26 Oct 2020, 15:56 @coulomb I am sending and checking the proper CRC every time from my Arduino, just when using the console I found out the bug.
Yes, it's not the sort of thing you expect!
I'm afraid that a communication error might corrupt a command, eg POP00 to POP02, one bit difference.
Indeed. Maybe we'll patch the removable display firmware one day to do it.
I do get CRC errors sometimes, when requiring QPIGS, like 1 in 1000 responses.
The QPIGS command doesn't check its own CRC either, so I assume you mean the response occasionally has a CRC error, checked at your Arduino's end.

Perhaps they figure that commands, which are typically fairly short, don't need CRC protection. But responses can be of the order of 100 characters, so they need the CRCs.
If the PIP checked the CRCs then I would be more confident that my commands are received correctly.
I'm sure we all would.

[ Edit: "response has a CRC error" → "response occasionally has a CRC error" ]

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Wed, 28 Oct 2020, 04:17
by data
I need your help: Installation is a couple of Pip-5048MK and an array of Pylontech US2000 batteries
.
How can I configure the 5048MK so that it switches to utility once the battery is empty/below a certain SoC level?
Using the voltage settings for switching between utility and battery mode does not work reliable.

What settings have I missed / what is your configuration??

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Wed, 28 Oct 2020, 06:32
by coulomb
data wrote: Wed, 28 Oct 2020, 04:17 How can I configure the 5048MK so that it switches to utility once the battery is empty/below a certain SoC level?
Using the voltage settings for switching between utility and battery mode does not work reliable.
Presumably you've been using the back to utility setting (setting 12). I guess that would be poor for high SOC values, especially without load and charge battery voltage compensation (KettleKomp).

You will need to find a suitable monitoring program, ICC, SilPippLog, etc. Either one that can talk to the US2000 BMS, or to a separate battery monitor like a BMV.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Wed, 28 Oct 2020, 17:16
by data
@coulomb So there is no way to make it work correctly without any additional controller?!

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Thu, 29 Oct 2020, 03:03
by birdibird
@MJS-1

I saw your post about error #69 on the MK.
My friend has 69 also appear. Did you have any good results in trying out the different firmwares?
What is #69 exactly saying? the manual shows: "If battery status is not allowed to charge after the communication between the inverter and battery is successful, it will show code 69 to stop charging battery"

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Thu, 29 Oct 2020, 05:20
by coulomb
data wrote: Wed, 28 Oct 2020, 17:16 So there is no way to make it work correctly without any additional controller?!
No. The inverter has no way of knowing the real SOC, unless it talks to the battery's BMS. When it does, they didn't change the logic to respond to SOC instead of battery voltage, as the Growatts do. So an additional controller has to respond to the true SOC, and send commands to override the usual voltage based logic.

Maybe one day Voltronic Power will see the light and fix the firmware, or maybe patched firmware could do it, but both of those are probably a long way in the future, if they ever happen.

Sorry for the bad news.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sun, 01 Nov 2020, 05:23
by birdibird
birdibird wrote: Thu, 29 Oct 2020, 03:03 @MJS-1

I saw your post about error #69 on the MK.
My friend has 69 also appear. Did you have any good results in trying out the different firmwares?
What is #69 exactly saying? the manual shows: "If battery status is not allowed to charge after the communication between the inverter and battery is successful, it will show code 69 to stop charging battery"
To answer my own question:
I found this thread on powerform.
I'll upgrade to firmware 71.94 (and display 02.49)

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Sun, 01 Nov 2020, 05:45
by mrzed001
Hi, Newbie here !

I am about to make a UPS system (LiFePO4 cells already ordered: 16x 3,2V 280Ah) and I was thinking to use the 5048MK inverter with them.
So my main goal is not solar production, but online (double conversion) UPS function.
With Line mode both AC/DC and DC/AC inverters to run all the time (I know 10-15% power loss).
Mainly under 1000W constant usage (PC, TV, gas convector, fridge, some LED lamps ... only in a possible big blackout: inverter AC, pump).

Possible later I connect some solar panels to the inverter but I think the MPPT of this inverter is far from ideal with the 145Vmax.
Makes more sense to me to use a good grid-tie inverter with the solar panels, and connect it to the utility side of the MK inverter. If blackout then no power is generated, I know.

Why I wrote ?
I am very happy that I found this forum where users share real life practical experience about this inverter.
And I wanted to now what are you thinking about this setup ?
What are the problems I can run into with this inverter ?
Did anyone used it like I would like to use ?

For one: I read the thread and the constant battery charge seems to be a problem. Lithium cells hate (overcharge) when they are full and charging is not stopped.
Setting the float V to the battery relax V (ca 16 x 3,3V) could solve it ? (so no V difference and so no current is flowing)

Thanks for any information

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 00:07
by Calvin
mrzed001 wrote: Sun, 01 Nov 2020, 05:45 For one: I read the thread and the constant battery charge seems to be a problem. Lithium cells hate (overcharge) when they are full and charging is not stopped.
Setting the float V to the battery relax V (ca 16 x 3,3V) could solve it ? (so no V difference and so no current is flowing)
To be fair, the inverter has always respected the bulk/float voltages (with perhaps a bit too much overshoot). The problem is if you have a BMS that requests a voltage that is very close to the limit (like the Pylontech batteries do) the inverter can overshoot, causing the BMS to issue a "stop charging" request to the inverter. In earlier firmware versions this caused the inverter to shut down. These problems have been largely addressed in latest firmware 71.94, and anyway only apply when you use direct BMS communication. Most people who use these inverters with Li-ion batteries have some form of external controller (ICC, solpiplog, home made) to control the inverter as the inverter still use voltage rather than SOC as input for its control decisions, even when having access to the BMS information.

The other problem with the continuous AC charging at 2A (even when disabled in settings) has been fixed since firmware version 71.93.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 03:49
by affer
i am getting a pair of pylontech soon, and it seems that it is time to upgrade the firmware from the test firmware that weber and coloumb provided me with long time ago, to the newest. Posts mentions 71.94, does any one have a link?

and i have to update the display firmware too, 2.49 i can find :-D but which one to update first? display or 71.94?

Thanks.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 08:51
by coulomb
affer wrote: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 03:49 Posts mentions 71.94, does any one have a link?
I have uploaded it to the Powerforum now and added a link in the index.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 18:16
by mrzed001
Calvin wrote: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 00:07 To be fair, the inverter has always respected the bulk/float voltages (with perhaps a bit too much overshoot). The problem is if you have a BMS that requests a voltage that is very close to the limit (like the Pylontech batteries do) the inverter can overshoot, causing the BMS to issue a "stop charging" request to the inverter. In earlier firmware versions this caused the inverter to shut down. These problems have been largely addressed in latest firmware 71.94, and anyway only apply when you use direct BMS communication. Most people who use these inverters with Li-ion batteries have some form of external controller (ICC, solpiplog, home made) to control the inverter as the inverter still use voltage rather than SOC as input for its control decisions, even when having access to the BMS information.

The other problem with the continuous AC charging at 2A (even when disabled in settings) has been fixed since firmware version 71.93.

So if I do not use Pylontech, make my own pack with BMS then it will be fine.

Can this inverters really handle the continuous line mod ? Or will they fail after some years of use ?

I read about solpiplog here. I will check it out.

Thanks

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 19:56
by Calvin
mrzed001 wrote: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 18:16 Can this inverters really handle the continuous line mod ? Or will they fail after some years of use ?
I am afraid that I cannot answer that - I use mine in off-grid mode.

There is a user called Gnome on the SA Power Forum who uses a King as a UPS - perhaps you could ask him.

Re: PIP-5048MK inverter

Posted: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 23:20
by affer
coulomb wrote: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 08:51
affer wrote: Tue, 03 Nov 2020, 03:49 Posts mentions 71.94, does any one have a link?
I have uploaded it to the Powerforum now and added a link in the index.
Thanks, in which order do you recommend update? display or 71.94 first?