PIP-4048MS and PIP-5048MS inverters

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PIP-4048MS inverter

Post by paulvk » Mon, 07 Nov 2016, 01:17

I have noticed that my inverters seem to follow the mains frequency has anyone else noticed this?
Last edited by paulvk on Sun, 06 Nov 2016, 14:18, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Solar Junky » Mon, 07 Nov 2016, 01:17

Thanks coulomb,
easy to disconnect it.
seems like it's working same as befor grounding solar & battery to earth
but did that some time ago and forgot about it.
Last edited by Solar Junky on Thu, 24 Nov 2016, 16:36, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by paulvk » Mon, 07 Nov 2016, 01:23

Note about earthing: As I have a 48V telco battery system as part of my battery racks the positive is earthed but no earthing on pos or neg from panels it has been working for nearly 2 years this way.

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Post by coulomb » Mon, 07 Nov 2016, 05:32

paulvk wrote: I have noticed that my inverters seem to follow the mains frequency ...
I believe it was Weber who stated not long ago that the inverters probably synchronise with the mains for the least difficulty when switching the loads to and from mains and inverter output. That seems quite plausible.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
160 W solar, 2.5 kWh 24 V battery for lights.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by Solar Junky » Tue, 08 Nov 2016, 07:19

Weber is my hero! fixed my d9 to usb problem.
My d9 cable went bad somehow???????? Did try a new one long time ago but took it back???? must have messed up the drivers then????
Now it's time to update firmware!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YEAH!!!!!!!!!!! AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
But need a mental break been working on this thing for days!!!!!!! lol!!!

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Post by Solar Junky » Tue, 08 Nov 2016, 07:23

Thanks weber have learned lots in the last few days.....

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Post by Tjadenw » Fri, 11 Nov 2016, 06:04

Is it possible to perform a voltage calibration on the 24 volt model that only have a USB port using access port ? I can fine lots of info on the PIP4048 voltage calibration using access port but nothing for the usb 24 volt 3kva model.

My 24 volt inventor seems to be .2 volts lower that the actual values when testing with a volt meter

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Post by coulomb » Fri, 11 Nov 2016, 15:34

Tjadenw wrote: Is it possible to perform a voltage calibration on the 24 volt model that only have a USB port using access port ?
I believe that unlike the 48 V models, you can send commands to the 24 V models over USB. It's a virtual comms port, I think, even limited to 2400 bps.

But a quick check of the only 24 V firmware I have at present indicates that there is no BTA0-2 command, so if there is a calibration facility, it is very different to that of the 48 V models. Many of them also use a different processor (Freescale HCS08 versus a TI TMS320F2809). [ Edit: a later version I found does have the calibration commands, and does use a TMS320 processor. ]

I can fine lots of info on the PIP4048 voltage calibration using access port but nothing for the usb 24 volt 3kva model.
That seems to confirm my suspicion that they don't have calibration at all. [ Edit: I meant in the sense of a user instigated command based calibration. It may be possible to change an EEPROM value somehow, for a fixed scale change. ]

Your best bet for fixing this would seem to be finding the appropriate voltage divider resistor (or chain of resistors), and tweaking the values until it reads more accurately. Of course, you can't do much about drift and so on, but it sounds like a decent improvement could be had that way, if you are hardware inclined.

[ Edit: "They also use a different processor" -> "Many of them use a different processor" ]
[ Edit: "BAT0-2" -> "BTA0-2" ]
Last edited by coulomb on Fri, 11 Nov 2016, 04:36, edited 1 time in total.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
160 W solar, 2.5 kWh 24 V battery for lights.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by offgridQLD » Mon, 14 Nov 2016, 14:27

A few of us in Brisbane took note of how ridiculously fast the shipping time was on a inverter that was aparently being shipped from Taiwan to Australia.

My first order several years ago was placed on a Friday and on the Monday I had a package at my doorstep. Though I didn't bother going through the tracking slips to look into it in detail.

It was mentioned that perhaps they have a storage facility in Au with local stock.

I now have a new project that requires another PIP4048. So I ordered a 2nd PIP last Friday afternoon online and tracked the delivery. I'm 99% sure they are actually being shipped from Taiwan and its just an incredibly efficient postal service. Living offgrid and relying on iverters to power your house and essentials being able to obtain a replacement or part over a weekend is not bad for a imported product.


Not to mention the shipping on this pip4048 was free and I was offered an extra 5% discount on the total price $949 AU delivered.

Image



Last edited by offgridQLD on Mon, 14 Nov 2016, 03:39, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by PGutti » Mon, 14 Nov 2016, 23:59


Good to know! One question: Where did you order? MPP Solar or Voltronic?
(or is then name saying that Image

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Post by Tjadenw » Tue, 15 Nov 2016, 23:22

Thanks for the info Coulomb.

Do you know what the adjustment's on the SCC are for ?
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Post by offgridQLD » Tue, 15 Nov 2016, 23:46

They look like the terminal posts to me .

Edit: Yes mpp solar eBay
Last edited by offgridQLD on Tue, 15 Nov 2016, 13:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by coulomb » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 15:46

Tjadenw wrote: Do you know what the adjustment's on the SCC are for ?
I assume you mean the red circles, not the blue arrows.

Sorry, no idea. We didn't reverse engineer the SCC, except to the tiny extent required to figure out what the relays were doing.

We were interested in what is commoned to what input to output, so we could sensibly measure the PV voltage. Presumably to disconnect the PV on the rare cold sunny morning with a 3S PV panel configuration. We don't even do that now (attempt to measure the PV voltage).

I don't think there is much chance of doing anything useful by tweaking them.
Last edited by coulomb on Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 04:47, edited 1 time in total.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
160 W solar, 2.5 kWh 24 V battery for lights.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by paulvk » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 16:10

It would have been nice if the SCCs were 80amps instead of 60 because during winter you need more panels to get the amps needed but in summer you can not use them due to the 60amp limit.
One thought I have is to find the current sense component and change it to fool the system after looking at fet current specs.

Now an observation on the operation of the standard firmware
The setting to go back to grid reacts too fast to the set voltage eg you put the kettle on to boil water when close to the set voltage and it goes back, it is like the charge problem not waiting long enough.
Next time when the firmware is worked on if you can see this variable could a time limit be added of say 5 to 8 mins so short term heavy loads do not trigger it prematurely.

Also if I can help you guys in any way let me know!
Note my warranty is up at the end of the year so then I will load your up dated firmware.

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Post by andys » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 16:21

I've connected 4.3kW (rated) panels to my system due to winter/cloud needs.

During cloud-burst activity on cold days, I sometimes see the output rise to a peak of 4.5kW, and the PIP keeps going, even for 10 to 15 seconds.

I didn't expect performance like this.. I wonder if I am risking any damage.

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Post by andys » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 16:24

Addendum:

During this peak time, the query command reads 80 amps at 80 volts. Which makes no sense, so I assume something is limiting the output to the rated (4kW) with ~10% leeway.

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Post by paulvk » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 18:25

When I had one PIP and the 24 panels the maximum charge was 61 amps this would go for about one hour or so even if I set the charge to 80 amps so the SCC has to be limiting this.
With the two in parallel I have had up to 85 amps and average 76 amps I will in the future have 18 panels for each PIP this should give a constant 60 amps per unit, due to the de-rating of output of panels with temperature I get 185 to 195 watts per panel (average 185 in summer)

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Post by coulomb » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 18:28

andys wrote: During this peak time, the query command reads 80 amps at 80 volts. Which makes no sense...

No, you have to remember that it measures the 80 V at the input and the 80 A at the output. So that would be 80 A times say 56 V (guessed battery voltage) for a product of 4,480 W.

Edit: so that's around 60 A at the input. There are models with 80 A of rated output; perhaps yours is one of them?
Last edited by coulomb on Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 07:34, edited 1 time in total.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
160 W solar, 2.5 kWh 24 V battery for lights.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by andys » Wed, 16 Nov 2016, 20:04

coulomb wrote: No, you have to remember that it measures the 80 V at the input and the 80 A at the output.


Thats right - Thanks. So I guess its still within spec for current.

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Post by Tjadenw » Sat, 19 Nov 2016, 00:23

paulvk wrote: One thought I have is to find the current sense component and change it to fool the system after looking at fet current specs.


I also Had the thought of doing this to fool the amp sense also with voltage.

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Post by Solar Junky » Sat, 19 Nov 2016, 10:12


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Post by vast » Sun, 20 Nov 2016, 07:06

Hello to everyone from Romania.

My system is:
- inverter/charger: PIP4048MS - 80A charger (bought in March)
- panels: 20x185W = 3700Wp Sharp NU-S5E3E
- battery: 16s LiFePO4 Sinopoly 100Ah

Which are the best setup for this inverter?

I setup in menu #26 (Bulk) and #27 (Float): 54.5V and #29 (Low DC cut-off voltage): 48V. But how to setup in menu #12 (Setting voltage point back to utility source when selecting "SBU priority" or "Solar first" in program 01) and #13 (Setting voltage point back to battery mode when selecting "SBU priority" or "Solar first" in program 01)?
Mention: I don't have utility source.

Something in menu which I don't like: software don't have setup for Absorb and Absorb time.

A friend tell me that PCM60X (MPPT) have in menu Absorb and Absorb time, but don't have Bulk.


Regards,
Valentin
Last edited by vast on Sun, 20 Nov 2016, 02:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Tjadenw » Mon, 21 Nov 2016, 23:29

Your best bet for fixing this would seem to be finding the appropriate voltage divider resistor (or chain of resistors), and tweaking the values until it reads more accurately. Of course, you can't do much about drift and so on, but it sounds like a decent improvement could be had that way, if you are hardware inclined.


Im learning as I go more of a handyman, any pointer's where on the inverter board the voltage would be sensed ?

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Post by Solar Junky » Tue, 22 Nov 2016, 01:27

Tjadenw wrote:
Your best bet for fixing this would seem to be finding the appropriate voltage divider resistor (or chain of resistors), and tweaking the values until it reads more accurately. Of course, you can't do much about drift and so on, but it sounds like a decent improvement could be had that way, if you are hardware inclined.


Im learning as I go more of a handyman, any pointer's where on the inverter board the voltage would be sensed ?


The on/off switch has same voltage going through it as batteries so maybe follow that.

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Post by coulomb » Tue, 22 Nov 2016, 05:24

vast wrote: Hello to everyone from Romania.
Welcome, Valentin.
Mention: I don't have utility source.
Do you mean you don't have mains power to connect to the AC input, or not even a generator? If nothing is connected to the AC input, do you mean you want to avoid utility mode altogether? With nothing connected to the AC input, the PIP will never select it as an input anyway.
Something in menu which I don't like: software don't have setup for Absorb and Absorb time.
Yes, but it's automatic. The charger(s) stay in bulk/absorb mode until the battery charge current reduces to a low value. But if you have float and bulk voltages set the same (menu #26 and menu #27), then it doesn't really matter whether the charger is in bulk/absorb or float modes, or how long is spends in either mode.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
160 W solar, 2.5 kWh 24 V battery for lights.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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