error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

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Joy
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error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Dear all,


Happy new year and thank you for letting me into your forum .i am honestly really impressed what you do out of thoses pips, I haven't seen else.

I actually have 3 pip 5048 running in 3p mode with firm 72,30 twice and 72,40 once.
Under load of approx 2kw each error 58 is shown and system quits all service and the only chance is to shut off everything and restart .than no issue any more until heavier loads occur. It Doesn't matter if it is set to ut or sbu to reproduce the issue.
I opened the pip but couldnt see a destroyed part.lukily I found your threads and made all my way through. However, do you have a tip for me?I don't know where to start as even the repair manual doesn't fit to the issue (it restatarts and also charges batterie).


Greetings from Germany

Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Dear all,


Shall i put it in the inverter thread or is it due to my question that I get no reply or what do I need to do differently?

Br

Joy
T1 Terry
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by T1 Terry »

Welcome to the forum Joy ... I did look up what the code meant and it was low output voltage ...... at about that point I did what it seems everyone else who viewed the topic .... waited for someone who might have an idea regarding a fix ..... Is it still in warranty? Have you tried the shut down/reboot including disconnecting the solar and battery input? Apart from that, if you bought it through evilbay, good luck trying to get across what the problem is ..... we got the feeling the person on the other end of the emails was deliberately not understanding English .... so we gave up ... as in, we no longer buy from MPP Solar any more and swapped to Victron equipment ..... more expensive but it doesn't fall over just outside warranty and we don't have to pay crazy shipping costs to get replacement boards that we had to fit .... simply return it to the agent 1 1/2 hrs away, they fix it and return it at their cost if under warranty ....

T1 Terry
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coulomb
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by coulomb »

Joy wrote: Sat, 08 Jan 2022, 04:36 I actually have 3 pip 5048 running in 3p mode with firm 72,30 twice and 72,40 once.
Those are fairly old inverter firmware versions. Usually, you would want to run the exact same firmware on all three. One possibility would be to update to firmware version 73.00 (factory), or 73.00e (patched). [ Edit: Arrgh! I forgot about the overlap in inverter version numbers. These are fairly recent version numbers for 64 V firmwares. ]
Under load of approx 2kw each error 58 is shown and system quits all service and the only chance is to shut off everything and restart .than no issue any more until heavier loads occur. It Doesn't matter if it is set to ut or sbu to reproduce the issue.
Has it ever worked in 3-phase mode?
Do you have the "paralleling" boards and cables installed? For 3 machine 3-phase, you do NOT connect the current sharing cables.
Do the three inverters share the same battery?
What battery are you using?

There aren't all that many 3-phase installations, so there isn't as much experience with this as with paralleled inverters.
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.
Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Hi,


Thank you for your answers.i was loosing hope with my system im fighting with since month until i found your forum.
Unfortunately warranty is gone as it took me some time to get the stuff installed...
The 3 inverters worked in 3p but with the typical inverter per phase on its own issue is not helpful.
What i could find out is that for a sec one inverter got 230v utility on the output.
Do you have an recommendation to start searching for the issue or simply going through the repair manual?

I used your feedback and updated to 72.20e as mine are 64v ones. (Or shall i use 73.00e?)according to the firmware thread that shall be the right and last version.
The update to 72,20e worked fantastic,awesome job from you guys.
Furthermore I went to single phase and paralell mode and things are running smooth, but i still have some lights lighting up for a millisecond at some point,could be when system goes to utility but not sure. did you have that case? I couldn't test under heavy laod yet how th we system behaves.

Besides of the update i tried your teraterm and settings but nothing is shown on the screen and now commands can be set shock: what shall tera term show?the crc code only as lines?

Thank you for all your help

Br

Joy
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coulomb
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by coulomb »

Joy wrote: Fri, 14 Jan 2022, 04:10 The 3 inverters worked in 3p but with the typical inverter per phase on its own issue is not helpful.
I think we have a slight communication issue; I don't understand the "typical inverter per phase issue".
What i could find out is that for a sec one inverter got 230v utility on the output.
What voltage do you see most of the time, when faut code 58 is not present?
Do you have an recommendation to start searching for the issue or simply going through the repair manual?
Please answer the rest of my questions first: paralleling cards, battery, etc.
I used your feedback and updated to 72.20e as mine are 64v ones.
Arrgh! I forgot about the overlap in version numbers! You did the right thing, assuming that it's a PF1 model (i.e. 5 kVA and 5 kW); I believe that all 64 V models are PF1.
(Or shall i use 73.00e?)
NO! 73.00e is for PF0.8 models (5 kVA and 4 kW) and 58.4 V.
Furthermore I went to single phase and paralell mode and things are running smooth,
So now you have the current sharing cables installed?

Are all inverters in output mode PAL (might be PAr with patched firmware)?

Outputs actually connected together, or separate loads?
but i still have some lights lighting up for a millisecond at some point,
Do you mean light emitting diodes (if so, which one(s)?), or segments on the LC Display?
could be when system goes to utility but not sure. did you have that case?
I'm not aware of LC Display segments unexpectedly coming on for a fraction of a second, no.
i tried your teraterm and settings but nothing is shown on the screen and now commands can be set shock: what shall tera term show?the crc code only as lines?
I'm not understanding this. Can you break it down for me please? What commands did you send; how were you calculating and sending CRCs, what was the response (if any) to each command?

What exactly was/is the problem with settings?

Sorry to have to ask so many questions, but so many times if I make assumptions, they will turn out to be wrong, and confusion multiplies.
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.
Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

coulomb wrote: Fri, 14 Jan 2022, 07:32 I think we have a slight communication issue; I don't understand the "typical inverter per phase issue".
Was just meant as an information, What i meant is that you have the typical efficiency loss on 3p as each inverter feeds its own phase. So if you come over 5kw on one phase, the inverter it could go on strike, while the others are still idling. However i haven't seen more than 2,5 kw on each phase and the system went already to error 58.
To see if the issue happen come from 3p, i went to parallel mode with all three inverters on one phase.
coulomb wrote: Fri, 14 Jan 2022, 07:32 What voltage do you see most of the time, when faut code 58 is not present?

Arrgh! I forgot about the overlap in version numbers! You did the right thing, assuming that it's a PF1 model (i.e. 5 kVA and 5 kW); I believe that all 64 V models are PF1.

if not present, smaller loads and utility stable at around 230v.
But when i see the error coming up, I could see thoses issues:
- under heavier loads like 2kw or more i see the 230v decreasing to sth like 220v or less and then erro 58 coming up. and the system than blocks completly and needs to be disconnected from all sources and be restarted to suplpy utility ( 230v over here)
- or when utility is support is and the system swithches from S to B to U- that low consumtion lights (in the house on 230v) are flashing up for milisecond.
- And sometimes system is not mooving from Battery to utility under heavier loads although connected and going straight to error 58.

I will see this weekend with higher battery cut of voltages (along with the clipping info i just got from you guys) and the new firmware 72.20e if improves and perhpahs by excluding the inverter i suppose to be sick. (the one that might have been ac supplied utilitiy to ac inverter out)


The system has just recently been installed, lying around for several years. It worked in 3 p mode and parallel mode, sometimes showing the error 58 code. Cards are installed and working ( i can see all inverters through watchpower while using one usb only) . volatage cable i only use in parallel mode and take them of while testing 3p mode. All three inverters run on 72.20 e now.

Tera Term - i need to try later as i did sth wrong looking through the forum. I thought that Tera Term would read out the data from the Inverters but it was showing nothing. Now i read that need to make alt shift 7. I will try this and you a heads up.

Thank you very much and have a nice sunny weekend

joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by coulomb »

Joy wrote: Sat, 15 Jan 2022, 00:57 What i meant is that you have the typical efficiency loss on 3p as each inverter feeds its own phase. So if you come over 5kw on one phase, the inverter it could go on strike, while the others are still idling.
Ah, of course. When most of your loads (possibly all) are single phase.
... the inverter i suppose to be sick. (the one that might have been ac supplied utilitiy to ac inverter out)
Hopefully that should not have caused a problem. The firmware is designed for paralleling inverters, so it detects the presence of AC on the output terminals and won't connect the output relay unless everything is synchronised and happy.
The system has just recently been installed, lying around for several years.

I wonder if some capacitors dried out from lack of use. It's possible that the capacitors might come good with operation, though usually they have to be "reformed" by slowly charging them. If "several" means about 3 years, I would not expect that to be a problem.
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.
Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Hi,


Yes 2.5years max were the inv off.but good point i forgot.perhaps I shall try to measure the inverter all through as in the manual.
BTW,the numbers mentioned for exchanging parts are internal voltronic ones or from the forum.and to be bought somewhere?i couldn't find them on Google.

If the relay was active what would you suppose to be destroyed. Apparently it was only for a couple seconds but black smoke came out i was told now..if I'd known before...anyway..do you have a tip where to look?

However despite of the overload issue over 2kw,sometimes not going back to grid when battery is empty and this millisecond light flashing 8n the house i couldn't find any issue until now on.the system.

Sunny Greetings


Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by coulomb »

Joy wrote: Sat, 15 Jan 2022, 16:42 BTW,the numbers mentioned for exchanging parts are internal voltronic ones or from the forum.and to be bought somewhere?i couldn't find them on Google.
Those look like internal Voltronic Power parts numbers. But mostly (apart from transformers), they are standard parts, and you can buy them from the likes of Digi-Key, Mouser, and so on. You can find an abbreviated part number on the parts, or if they're very small an SMD code, and you look that up on-line. For example, the IGBTs below (which are possibly what blew up) say GP4063D, made by International Rectifier, have the letters IR on them. The real part number starts with IRGP4063D (the D is important, the letters following the D not important), and that's what you search for. Yours will almost certainly have IRGP4066D parts. Unfortunately, these are at their end of life, and will be hard to find. But I'm sure that there will be substitutes out there. Let's worry about that if you get that far.
If the relay was active what would you suppose to be destroyed. Apparently it was only for a couple seconds but black smoke came out i was told now..if I'd known before...anyway..do you have a tip where to look?
It helps if you are experienced with electronics repair. But if you're curious, it should be safe enough to take the bad one apart, life out the main board (follow the instructions in the PIP inverter repairs and hardware modifications topic, see the index in the first post), take out the main board, and check the parts at the left end of a heatsink that look a bit like this (from a different model). The damage may not be as obvious as these:

Image
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.
Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Hi,

Thank you for all your help and input.
I m a electronic curious and in ancient times soldered some easy stuff myself like simple boards.

I will try myself through the repair manual and your modifs.


Br

Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Frank2021 »

Wenn ein PIP kaputt ist müßte das aber schon beim Einzeltest auffallen. Ich denke da war alles ok?

[ Moderator Google translation: ]
If a PIP is broken, however, this should already be noticeable during the individual test. I think then everything was ok?
Joy
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Re: error code 58 on pip 5048 and no idea where to start

Post by Joy »

Hi ,


You mean while starting?
No nothing is shown so far.


Br
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