Imiev measured data

Post by **offgridQLD** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 01:53

Yes it's been charging to 100% SOC fine. I always check the SOC with Canion to make sure it has reached 100%.

As for the 12v battery. simple way to check a flooded lead acid so just check the SG the next morning after a good drive.

Kurt

Post by **reecho** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 02:21

My 12VDC battery was changed before i took delivery.

I get the feeling the cars were sitting around for a while before they were shipped to Perth.

Post by **Malm** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 06:53

Some Portuguese data:

Most of the times my car shut off only at 0,0% SoC. But not always, sometimes it gives me a extra bar around 30% SoC if I stop for some hours with that SoC, and then it will shut off with 2 or 3% SoC. The following pictures are from two times when it happened (this behavior is unusual).

In april 2014:

And in 2/8/2014:

It looks better the last time (as I would like

). Maybe in the last one the effect of the temperature (being higher-don't forget north hemisphere).

Post by **Malm** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 08:02

More Portuguese data: two identical trips (exactly the same roads):

I don't really know how to explain the difference. Maybe I did the first in B and the last in D.

Post by **Malm** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 08:24

That last time, when I went to 4% SoC (and with 287 V, and sure that it would shut off above 0,0% SoC), I made a full charge. Surprisingly (at least for me), it stopped charging at 96% SoC with 361 V (this time it was really really full - cell voltages 4,1 or 4,105 V). And only 14,89 kWh from that 4% (that for me are two) and 96% (that for me, with that voltages, where about 98/99%).

I think it showed me in that charge that sometimes it needs only something like 15,4 kWh to go from total empty to total full. I was expecting a number above 16, regarding the values obtained in other charges (but without going so low).

Post by **offgridQLD** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 12:59

The data dosn't look reliable or consistent.

I can't really conclud anything from it other than the cars monitoring system is having trouble following your battery's SOC precisely over its full SOC sweep. I thaught I mentioned befor that SOC meters on battery's are never perfect. There are to many variables . Though it's better than nothing so we use it. I'm sure the hard limits in the bms are accurate so (cell voltage) is most likely reliable data but SOC in 0.5% increments over the full sweep with up to 3c discharge and 3c regen potential on the cell being monitored for SOC?

Kurt

Post by **offgridQLD** » Tue, 05 Aug 2014, 14:32

What I am thinking is all battery monitors I have ever used have to have the battery's capacity entered into monitoring unit to give it a datum.

Usually its just a AH capacity number.I would hope the imiev had a better way. So the car started out with a capacity number to work with. How that is adjusted over time for capacity loss is unknown.

Then there is the mention in the user manual of recalibration of the capacity meter if you charge up from bellow 2 bars. how that works in detail is unknown.

So knowing how the Imiev adjusts it's capacity calibration is important.

In any case if its making tweaks that you don't know about then its hard to follow the results. We really need to know in detail how the system works and the details of the monitoring system and capacity reading before we can use the data with any certainty.

Kurt

Post by **Malm** » Wed, 06 Aug 2014, 04:49

Yesterday it ended the day at 6,5% SoC. Full charge over the night, took
13,64 kWh. 14,4 kWh from 0 to 100%.

Post by **reecho** » Sun, 07 Sep 2014, 19:36

A built in 2DIN Android radio that runs Canion??

Yes..!!

I have ordered one to see how it goes....

Post by **offgridQLD** » Sun, 07 Sep 2014, 19:49

OH great. That was my original Idea but the developer of the Canion app advised it most likely wouldn't work to well if at all due to processor speed and I think screen resolution on most android based double din stereo.

From that pic it doesn't look like its a issue anymore.Perhaps they have upped the specs of the units. Any info (link) to the model of the stereo.

My alternative was to mount my nexus v2 in the double din mount (fits nice) though I found it was to nice a tablet to dedicate to just the car.

Will follow the results with interest ....wanted to replace the stock stereo anyhow.

Kurt

Post by **acmotor** » Mon, 08 Sep 2014, 04:51

Interesting !
Screen only shows 298fps though?? Is that a problem ? Wouldn't you expect 400+ fps.
I really like the idea of a physical volume / power knob rather than soft key stabbing on the eclipse unit.
Keep us informed !

Post by **offgridQLD** » Mon, 08 Sep 2014, 04:57

I agree Acmotor even top shelf home receiver amps still use the good old volume dial.

Some people are running canion with some unused features turned off and the frame rate is reduced.

Kurt.

Post by **acmotor** » Mon, 08 Sep 2014, 05:09

I must not be understanding the frame rate then.
Doesn't the BT dongle send all the data stream to the android device independent of selected channels and the canion program extracts the data selected from the channels thus the pfs transferred is not dependent on the features of canion selected ? I really don't know but my fps is always around 400-450 independent of what canion is using. If I see less than 400 then something has crashed.

Post by **offgridQLD** » Mon, 08 Sep 2014, 05:45

I think turning off some of the more hungry unused features will lower the Frame rate displayed on Canion.

Have you tried disabling features you may not need.As I agree when running in standard config (all features enabled) 400fps - 450fps is what I see to.

On the latest version of canion. You can (tick box) what you want to be functional or not within the program. Trying disabling some hungry features and see the result in the frame rate.

Kurt.

Post by **reecho** » Tue, 09 Sep 2014, 01:51

offgridQLD wrote: OH great. That was my original Idea but the developer of the Canion app advised it most likely wouldn't work to well if at all due to processor speed and I think screen resolution on most android based double din stereo.

The pic was from here...Its from the Canion guys themselves... I-Miev Forum

video on the head unit here

To buy....use code "pumpkin" for discount...here

Post by **g4qber** » Tue, 09 Sep 2014, 14:06

Hi reecho
Do you still have to use a wireless obd2 dongle with this head unit ?

No dab+ I presume.

Was this te head unit you had installed on the Sunday of national science week?

Post by **offgridQLD** » Tue, 09 Sep 2014, 14:32

Yes you would have to use a OBD2 dongle for canion. Otherwise how would it communicate with your car if you didn't.

No DAB radio.

I think for the price it offers enough features to keep most happy. As long as it's stable. I'm always happy to give up some bells and whistles for stability.

Giving it's running android there would be endless options of how your could configure it and apps you could run. VS other head units that are fixed and very limited in there customization.

Just running cannon without having to have a tablet or phone tacked onto your dashboard or windscreen is a win.

Kurt

Post by **g4qber** » Wed, 10 Sep 2014, 15:25

can someone please provide me the power the imiev uses at 80kmh on a flat road

my observations is between 8 - 14kW

Post by **offgridQLD** » Wed, 10 Sep 2014, 20:34

The issue is not a lot of roads are perfectly flat. 8 - 14kw is a huge variation.

I would say it would be towards the lower end of your two numbers if you could find a dead flat surface.

I know that 12kw or 120whr-km is my average for steady constant 100kph driving though the roads are never perfectly flat.

Need to be on a runway or similar flat surface get up to 80kph and try and maintain it dead on for a few km.

Kurt

Post by **Malm** » Wed, 10 Sep 2014, 23:31

g4qber wrote: can someone please provide me the power the imiev uses at 80kmh on a flat road

my observations is between 8 - 14kW

For mine experience, I think that depends if are doing it on mode B or D.

Post by **g4qber** » Thu, 11 Sep 2014, 14:44

Canion reports that imiev uses 54.7kw on full acceleration.
I thought that the motor was limited to 47kw

Post by **offgridQLD** » Thu, 11 Sep 2014, 15:11

That would be 47kw at output shaft of the motor (perhaps even the rear wheels based on a dyno run video I watched).

Cannon is showing you kw (out of the battery) It's not 100% efficient from battery to output shaft of the motor.

That 54kw is is reduced from Losses in the controller, motor and system loads at the time.

Kurt

Post by **g4qber** » Thu, 11 Sep 2014, 15:40

http://www.elektriauto.ee/eng

seems imiev power is 49kw according to this website

Post by **g4qber** » Thu, 11 Sep 2014, 15:44

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_i-MiEV

47kw on wiki

Post by **7circle** » Fri, 12 Sep 2014, 01:40

I was wondering about air resistance losses.
And thought the mass of the air might vary enough to cause most of the 8 to 14 kW variation. +/-3 over 11 is like +/- 25%

1.1455 kg.m^-3 at 35degC
1.2922 kg.m^-3 at 0degC

So that's like a 12% difference just by temp change at 1 atm or 101.325 kPa. (Consider +/-20degC on 293K )

From Air mass on the wikipedea is Air Density

Temp and water vapour effect it.
The extra water vapour can reduce it which surprised me, but H20 is lighter than N2 and O2 significantly. So the partial pressures determine the overall pressure.

Air pressure can change change regularly 900kPa to 110kPa

What happens when it rains. This must reduce the kWh/km significantly

So the Aero losses are effected by.
- Head/Tail Wind and Cross wind.
- Pressure
- Temperature
- Humidity/Vapour pressure
- rain content or fog/cloud
(plus effect of road water displacement)

But it's also interesting that compared to ICE the cold air and humidity can also add power for given fuel rate.

Lots of discussion on the web with contradictions.

If your driving through patches of wet/rain and dry it would be interesting to know how much the kW/km changes for same speed.