Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Mitsubishi EV Interest Group
francisco.shi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by francisco.shi »

If you have an outlander to play with I am happy to have a chat to it and convince it to play nice.
I am sure a bigger battery and one pedal driving will be great on an outlander.
fifurnio
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

francisco.shi wrote: Thu, 21 Oct 2021, 08:31 It seems when they designed the old BMS they did what they needed to do for the job (and nothing more) there does not seem to be any allowance for changing the capacity of the cells or the current limit in or out of the pack. It kind of makes sense, why spend time making something more complicated than it needs to be if they were not intending to put bigger cells in the near future.
I found a way to set a different capacity in the canbus, it seemed to me that I was clear in my previous message.
The bms master of my Peugeot is Mitsubishi and has the same canbus protocol as iMiev, by sending the modified data the indication of the remaining range changes instantly
fifurnio
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

these are two sreenshot from a video I maked when I sent a message in the canbus
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richi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by richi »

Franco, what the GOM displays and what you actually achieve are two different things. Lying to the Coulomb-counting logic won't give you any more actual range (and risks over-discharging the weakest cells).
fifurnio
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

richi wrote: Wed, 03 Nov 2021, 17:16 Franco, what the GOM displays and what you actually achieve are two different things. Lying to the Coulomb-counting logic won't give you any more actual range (and risks over-discharging the weakest cells).
exactly
I only wrote that "playing" with that data manipulates the nominal capacity of the battery.
In my upgrade project the SOC is recalculated on the real voltage of the pack, this precisely to obtain the battery discharge at the correct value.
To obtain this result I am developing a complex algorithm that takes into account various parameters; discharge curve, recovery time, pack current, internal resistance, temperature.
The formula is still evolving, for example I am considering the possibility of keeping the coulombic calculation for the first part of the discharge, perhaps up to 70%, where this method certainly gives a more stable data.

No I am under the illusion of to be a genius, mind you, if on all the electrical vehicles I have the SOC is calculated in the same way and not with my algorithm there must be a reason, but I want to try, I want to get to a system that connects the SOC at the true value of the pack voltage to obtain a correct discharge, i.e. the exploitation of the battery at 100%, avoiding over-discharging or under-discharging
francisco.shi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by francisco.shi »

What I meant to say is that the BMS does not seem to have an option to change the setting of the battery capacity. It seems to be hard coded in the firmware.
If you want to modify the SOC by doing your own calculation you have to have a CAN bridge. You need to have a CAN channel that the BMS connects to and another channel that the car connects to. You then get the message from the BMS modify it and then send it to the car.
You can not just inject messages with the updated data without removing the original messages.
fifurnio
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

francisco.shi wrote: Thu, 04 Nov 2021, 05:36 What I meant to say is that the BMS does not seem to have an option to change the setting of the battery capacity. It seems to be hard coded in the firmware.
If you want to modify the SOC by doing your own calculation you have to have a CAN bridge. You need to have a CAN channel that the BMS connects to and another channel that the car connects to. You then get the message from the BMS modify it and then send it to the car.
You can not just inject messages with the updated data without removing the original messages.
I don't think I've ever said I want to do the "capacity" byte change operation without using adequate hardware

I am testing two different hardwares, one is this https://www.mrs-electronic.com/en/produ ... ro-gateway# and one is self-built and uses a PIC (in attachment)
This project is not only for my car, I rebuilt a BMW C-Evolution battery from 60 to 120 Ah and if also there the vehicle continue to run when SOC indication is zero I whant to obtain the correct SOC and range indication, to do this I have to recalculate SOC using voltage and current data in can line
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Last edited by fifurnio on Sat, 13 Nov 2021, 03:30, edited 1 time in total.
Timmytool
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by Timmytool »

Greame has released his intent to do upgrades to the miev battery:
https://www.ozelectricvehicles.com/upgrades
phil.shield
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by phil.shield »

Timmytool wrote: Thu, 11 Nov 2021, 10:46 Greame has released his intent to do upgrades to the miev battery:
https://www.ozelectricvehicles.com/upgrades
Graeme and his team have completed the battery upgrade on my iMiev just recently, I am very happy with the result.

It is a 2010 iMiev, one of the earliest. This was on the first shipment of production electric cars ever to come to Australia. The battery had a hard life. I drove it to Toowong and fully recharged it there to give it enough range to get out to @suziauto in Springwood where Graeme has his workshop (around 30 km). Apparently they had some difficulties getting the original battery pack out because the batteries had swollen. And there were some difficult access and fastener issues. Must have been from early in the production when Mitsubishi were still sorting out their processes.

Now it is back together with the new battery pack and over 200 km of range. To me this makes it more useful and valuable than it was when it was new. So far, I’ve just taken it for trips around the city, it’s got more than enough range and it’s great to drive. I’m looking forward to taking it out for longer trips out of town in coming weeks.

I’m keen to get the one pedal regen control option. Graeme has it in a test vehicle and I’ve had a test drive with @francisco.shi - thanks Francisco for taking the time to let me test it out. I really enjoyed it. The braking is strong enough to allow you to come to a come to a complete stop without touching the brake pedal. It will even hold on a hill without needing to use the brake pedal. I’m told it’s not quite ready, they are still fine tuning it. So I’m hoping to get it installed early next year and get the cruise control option at the same time.

Thanks to @suziauto, I’ve very happy with the battery upgrade.
francisco.shi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by francisco.shi »

I have a question for experienced Imiev drivers.
The battery capacity is reported from the BMS.
I then replaced the value (49Ah) with the current battery value (94Ah) and let the car work out the range.
This morning the car was fully charged and the GOM was reporting 299 km of range.
GOM reading
GOM reading
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This means that without the adjustment it would read 155 with an original new battery.
The upgraded battery is about 30kwh and I have been able to do 10kwh/100km.
So it is not ridiculous that it could potentially do 300km on one charge.
But is it realistic?
Should I try to fix this issue or should I just leave it an let Imiev driving experience convert the number to a realistic value?
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brendon_m
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by brendon_m »

Mine has a capacity of 26Ah and I regularly see 100km on the GoM. Drops like a rock for the first few kilometres and the real range is more like 80km (and more like 50 with some highway work). Personally Id say it's about normal for an Imiev and wouldn't bother trying to correct it
francisco.shi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by francisco.shi »

I decided to see how far I could go if I drove lightly.
When accelerating I tried to keep within the green zone and tried to coast to a stop as much as possible. I drove with the aircon continuously on half the time and the other half of the time was about 50% on/off.
Here are the results.
Distance traveled.
Distance traveled.
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Remaining range
Remaining range
20211121_215146.jpg (1.61 MiB) Viewed 332 times
SOC at begining of charging
SOC at begining of charging
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Charger stats at end of charging.
Charger stats at end of charging.
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I would say that using the NEDC rating we could say the Imiev is has 290km of range.
🤣🤣🤣
I only charged to 80% because some people turned up to use the charger.
Charge rate was 15kw (45A) at 80% charge.
I can drive normally now and keep the pedal to the metal. 🤣🤣
stoatwblr
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by stoatwblr »

Guys, is this posting over at the myimiev forum of any use?

http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4121
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coulomb
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by coulomb »

francisco.shi wrote: Sun, 21 Nov 2021, 20:50 Charge rate was 15kw (45A) at 80% charge.
The average charge rate from the final figures of 21.8 kWh and 0.7 h was about 31 kW, so IF it was a linear falling ramp (unlikely), the maximum charging rate would have been about 47 kW at the start.
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francisco.shi
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by francisco.shi »

It charges tat 100A and it starts to drop off at about 75% so it is 30kw max.
Some times it will go to 125A for a few min and then drop to 100A.
fifurnio
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

I went to the link http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4121 , Coulomb: looks like you tried to reprogram the master bms, but I didn't understand if you succeeded or if you rewrite the capacity data with a CAN bridge
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by coulomb »

fifurnio wrote: Mon, 22 Nov 2021, 17:50 I didn't understand if you succeeded or if ...
Sadly, all I succeeded in doing is to disassemble the CMU code. I gleaned a few clues about auto-numbering but that's about it.

I could not get anything done with the BMS at all.
MG ZS EV 2021 April 2021.
Nissan Leaf 2012 with new battery May 2019.
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Re: Aftermarket iMiEV battery upgrade project

Post by fifurnio »

has someone verified the data on the battery capacity and the insertion point of the can bridge in the network?
I my car (peugeot) I have two electronics (Mitsubishi, with own can network) one is the master bms, the other is the vehicle calculator, both electronics exchange data from one to each other, master bms receive data from slave bms in battery modules, calculate soc and soh, the other electronic control some services as power relè and calculate range autonomy.
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