Australian Grass Root EV Racing

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Post by Coulomb Racing » Fri, 13 Apr 2012, 06:16

There is obviously a group of us interested in this new formula of racing so why don't set a date and have a "committee" meeting/debate to discuss our own individual ideas and thrash out a proposal for the future of EV motorsport in Perth??
I'd be happy to host a meeting, I'm south of the river near Murdoch Uni

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Post by zeva » Fri, 13 Apr 2012, 16:48

I would be interested to attend such a meeting too!

Would also recommend trying to get Chris Jones along since he's already involved in the Aus electric motorbike racing scene and may know how these things get off the ground etc.
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Post by Clay » Fri, 13 Apr 2012, 23:00

I think we need people who would be willing to build and race the cars we'll be discussing to come, in addition to anyone else interested. It would be very difficult to come up with some great new category only for one or two people only to build cars.

The way i see it (and I'm not perfect so this could be the wrong way of looking at things) the chain of events needed to get something off the ground would be:

1. Formulate a category for the vehicles - I vote electrathon, others will have other ideas, we need to decide on one direction to pull in

2. Get a venue. The WASCC has offered Barbagallo to the eV Challenge if the safety was better, we could use that promise for our class. Collie would also be good. However this cannot happen unless we have a good, well thought out category to pitch to them

3. Build the cars. Like I said earlier, electrathon offers the bonus of allowing us to modify existing vehicles therefore cutting down build time

4. Set up a website and make it look slick. Pitch the series to existing ev people and ev challenge entrants. Build some momentum

5. Run an event and go from there.

Sounds easy but it will not be. However before anything else we need to have a solid 'product' to pitch to venue owners, insurance companies, sponsors etc.

I'm again excited about the prospect but I've also been down this road before and as a result am more than a little cautious about our expectations of what this event/series/category will accomplish. Let's get some ideas on what this category will look like together and pitch them here - it's easier than arguing to and fro around a table and ending up with nothing.

As mentioned a couple of times I think using the exsiting Electrathon regulations from the US is the way to go as they require zero writing to get them done. We then use standard motors and batteries to make everyone's lives easier in the short term - open slather can come later once we have a core group of racers.

Pitch your ideas and lets get this thing going!

p.s. Crash your ev looks mighty competitive for 2012...
Last edited by Clay on Fri, 13 Apr 2012, 13:02, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Thalass » Sat, 14 Apr 2012, 18:16

Karts sound pretty good to me. Not too expensive, you could do efficiency challenges as well as flat out racing, and they're accessible. If we want to go to something bigger then Formula Vee sounds pretty good.

My neighbour races a HQ holden at Barbagallo, and there is an endless supply of fairly cheap spares for them. Sadly it'll be another thirty or forty years before EVs can have that kind of classic car class. I'll be there with my Tesla Model S! haha.

Of course what i would really like to see is a round of TTXGP in Perth! And having said all that, i still haven't started my EV conversion due to money issues, and don't know much about the racing scene in general. As much as i would like to, i wouldn't be able to enter.
I'll drive an electric vehicle one day.

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Post by roddilkes » Sun, 15 Apr 2012, 03:54

WAEVA have the WA Electrikhana happening on Thurs 26th April starting 3pm. The day after Anzac Day.

Its an informal show & drive of electric vehicles at the RAC Driving Centre on Grogan rd near Perth International Airport.

A skid pan is available for eV Challenge type cars to strut their stuff. The pans are a big space. It is not a race, more of a tuning and ideas session. River Raiders team will have the latest model there for inspection.

If you have an eV Challenge car please bring it along. We can have some fun and swap ideas about EV racing. Just let me know asap so I can get a handle on the level of interest.

If you don't have a car but are interested you are also welcome to come along and have a chat. It would be great to meet you.

Regards, Rod Dilkes
Last edited by roddilkes on Mon, 07 May 2012, 04:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Faz » Mon, 16 Apr 2012, 20:50

Thalass wrote: Karts sound pretty good to me. Not too expensive, you could do efficiency challenges as well as flat out racing, and they're accessible. If we want to go to something bigger then Formula Vee sounds pretty good.


Funny I was thinking the exact same thing. Start out with karts and move to formula Vee.

edit: I would be keen for a meeting about ev racing too. I would be prepared to build a vehicle to race but as long as we are looking at budgets under $10,000.
Last edited by Faz on Mon, 16 Apr 2012, 11:06, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by jonescg » Wed, 18 Apr 2012, 04:20

I heard my name Image

If you want to get some good electric motorcycle racing action here in the West, try pressure Grant Cresswell and Terry O'Neil to bring a Formula Xtreme round over to Wanneroo. They have done a stack of track upgrades, so I'm sure us parochial Sandgropers will put on a good show.
I'm not racing this year due mostly to time and funds, and the lack thereof. I'm sad there's only two bikes on the grid for the first round. Anyone got a spare $4k I can borrow to get Voltron up to the task for QR in July?

I'm also in favour of an upgraded version of the EV challenge, even if it means reverting to four wheels Image Of course, an XtremeEbike race would be sweet too, sort of like what the guys in SoCal do with their motorbicycle racing.
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Post by Wellsey » Wed, 18 Apr 2012, 05:14

If it's grass root racing we're after then I think we have to chase the needs of the masses to entice them into the thrill of the technology, cause racing in an event with a single EV wouldn't be much fun, basically this means: as main stream, accessible and affordable as possible.

This thread seem to be taking three lines:
1. Whole new set-up especially designed of EVs that needs new legal/insurance, rules, meetings, significant sponsors, committees, etc etc etc. This can be achieved with tireless work by a very dedicated team of enthusiasts, but being so specialised would leave the masses somewhat out of the picture due to the bureaucratic of the detail and cost may become prohibitive.

2. Driver testing like maneuverability, precision, hill climbs etc that would fit into the current FAI and club classes etc. There are a number of classes that range from standard to highly modified available to those would like to pursue that path.

3. Karting... I think this is the class that can tick all of the boxes mentioned earlier. Accessible, cost effective for new entrants (<10k for the whole set-up), very cost effective for existing competitors - swap engine for motor, annual two stroke engine re-build by approved engine builder $2-4k), all the insurance/rules, officials, marshals, classes are already established by the FIA. Sticking to the FAI classifications means that you can relocate anywhere and still fit into a ratified class ans keep racing.

One or more of the above can be achieved but if we want to get a ground swell of participation, we need to get the most bang for the buck and attract as many competitor as possible.

I do believe that the EV community can and will support each other in the pursuit to progress the introduction of EVs into the racing scene. Obviously that's until the ladder is long enough to climb a number of rungs:-)

I think Faz is right, a budge of <$10k would entice more people to be involved....the more the merrier.

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Post by Faz » Wed, 18 Apr 2012, 19:02

jonescg wrote:Anyone got a spare $4k I can borrow to get Voltron up to the task for QR in July?


"Borrow" means I'll get it back right?

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Post by Clay » Thu, 19 Apr 2012, 01:03

My inclination, as previously mentioned, is towards electrathon vehicles rather than karts - but if karts are preferred, what about 'lay down' or enduro karts?

These things have the drivers laying down to reduce drag and usually race on proper racing rather than karting circuits - meaning way faster top speeds than normal. Google images of lay down karts and have a look - they look pretty cool...

If we end up going with karts these would at least still allow a lot of ingenuity in terms of design to go faster.

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Post by stuartri » Sat, 19 May 2012, 01:56

Clay I am in favour of an electrathon for a couple of reasons.

1. commonality of rules
2. leveraging similar events like the EV challenge
3. The possibility to foster international competition
4. Is a platfrom to foster new build knowledge sharing

There are a lot of retrofits in this site with great knowledge gained. Developing a community equipped to develop new cars is something we need.

Looking forward to catching up at the EV challenge this year.

Anyway just my thoughts.

Stuart




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Post by Coulomb Racing » Sat, 19 May 2012, 07:41

I am currently writing up a proposal and rules and regulations for the 2013 launch of the Perth Electric Endurance Series, should be finished within a week and I shall upload for review by everyone.

Regards,

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Post by Thalass » Sat, 26 May 2012, 17:09

I like those lay-down karts! Very neat.
I was reminded of this thread yesterday after seeing a go-kart for sale at a house down the road. $2k: Very tempting. Still need the bike first, though.

*edit*

I know people wouldn't take us seriously if the karts were like this, but man this is a great looking machine. It's just too noisy ;)

http://www.gadgetreview.com/2009/08/bat ... video.html
Last edited by Thalass on Sat, 26 May 2012, 17:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Wellsey » Sun, 27 May 2012, 07:10




Correction/Clarification needed about my previous post:

A friend of mine who has spent the last few decades in the motor racing scene (last one in Karting) passed on some comments in relation to my post.

"...Accessible, cost effective for new entrants (<10k for the whole set-up)..."
He agreed with this to a point, but said this is limited to initial cost of the Kart and set-up but the major costs are on-going (travel, accommodation running costs etc etc) and that Karting is (relatively speaking) an expensive form of motor sport.

"...very cost effective for existing competitors...."
He said this is true assuming all the base costs are covered from running one or more karts already and the electric kart is an additional class, not the only class being contested, especially if the electric kart is a running swap rather than a separate chassis.
The advice he gave was that if anyone was starting from scratch, the motorkhana format will most likely provide the biggest scope for entrants.

So, although the ticks may stay in the box for existing kart enthusiasts, it looks like they fade away when starting from scratch.

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Post by Coulomb Racing » Mon, 28 May 2012, 19:10

Hi Everyone,

For those following this thread it has been awhile, however I have progressed in my proposal for an electric endurance series.

Attached is the initial proposal for this series, Rules and regulations are 90% done and will be posted soon. Being kept relatively open to allow eV road registered cars to enter to bolster numbers and also to form two catergories, similar to LMP and Modified Production Cars in Le Mans.

Please give constructive criticism to my attached link..
If link doesn't work, send me an email at James.Hill@crhtelnet.com.au and I shall reply with an attachment of the file.

Regards,


James
Perth_Electric_Endurance_Series_Proposal.docx
Last edited by Coulomb Racing on Mon, 28 May 2012, 09:12, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by BigMouse » Mon, 28 May 2012, 19:52



Link doesn't work for me.

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Post by Coulomb Racing » Mon, 28 May 2012, 20:01

BigMouse do you have any way for me to send the file to you?
Private Message won't allow me to send the file through to you


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Post by BigMouse » Mon, 28 May 2012, 23:46

vtannahill at mauswerkz dot com

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Post by Thalass » Tue, 29 May 2012, 04:19

Doesn't work for me, either. :(

When you say endurance, do you mean a 24 hour race? Or an electrokhana style count of laps completed using X kWh of energy?

I'll drive an electric vehicle one day.

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Post by Coulomb Racing » Tue, 29 May 2012, 05:53

By endurance series I mean a combination to begin with leading up to a potential 12 hour or 24 hr race.

1200 Wh battery packs that can be swapped out are the basis of the new rules.


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Post by Thalass » Tue, 29 May 2012, 06:23

Oh that is interesting. You'd have to have an enjoyable track for that. Driving for 12 hours in a circle wouldn't be fun!
I'll drive an electric vehicle one day.

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Post by Coulomb Racing » Tue, 29 May 2012, 06:37

Plan at the moment is for MC Motorsport course out near the airport, being electric there is no noise concerns. Like I said before I am trying to encourage road-registered eV's to make up one of the categories so we should already have quite a base of vehicles to start with before we even get started with the prototype vehicles
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Post by Thalass » Wed, 30 May 2012, 02:34

On the subject of venues, it's a real shame Caversham Raceway was never really developed and will now become housing. That leaves Barbagello and Collie for track racing, right? I'm not actually sure, but it's a shame anyway. There could have been a racing circuit just down the road for me!
I'll drive an electric vehicle one day.

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