Ponilion's LiFePo4,5-33C LiPolymer battery

Post by **Gow864** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 19:09

Post by **Johny** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 19:52

OK - that works - but lots of the links on the site still point at ponilion.com? Needs fixing Jack.

Post by **woody** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 19:56

Hi Jackhyq,

my EV will be around 640 Volts nominal (224 cells in series) and range isn't that big a deal for me, so the ideal cell for me would be:

10-20Ah cell
>=30A continuous discharge
>=150A peak/pulse discharge for 10 seconds
>=5C continuous charge
>=100A pulse charge (10 seconds)
low internal resistance (2-4 mOhm equivalent series resistance)
good cycle life even with good moderate discharge (e.g. 2000+ cycles of 80% depth of discharge)

Do you have any cells of this spec or close?

cheers,
Woody

PS: Any response will be posted here, I will be happy if you do it directly

Post by **Johny** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 20:22

If you go to the ponilion.org site and select 'Documents' (2nd from the bottom on the left of the screen) or use This link
You can download various specs.

Post by **jackhyq** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 20:37

HeadsUp wrote: Jack

another idea , some companies will give big price discount to the first customers in a new market , they call it new market penetration discount structure.

in return for large discount to the buyers , the buyer will allow you to put information on your website about their project , with details , photographs and results, so this helps your buyers to gain confidence

Maybe ACMOTOR could help you with that , he has very refined knowledge.

best wishes

Edited
Jack
If you use my idea and get increased sales , can i have 0.2 % of the increased sales profit for the next two years

EDITED again

You would only need 2 - 4 showcase examples on your website of customers who used your product here in australia , i think that would be enough to boost your sales in Australia , USA , Canada and Europe

Builders and designers love to look at examples of other peoples work

xie xie

Thanks for your efforts and advice.
Later i will try ,of course your profit 2% or more will be thinking when get increase sales.Thanks again.

Post by **jackhyq** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 20:43

Johny wrote: jackhyq What is going on with your website? www.ponilion.com appears to be unavailable.

Now our website about www.ponilion.com for company official ,
www.ponilion.org for making more widespread .

As i know from engineers of IT Depts, there is problems about ICP recorders by our government,and they had been tried to let that www.ponilion.com appear.
Sorry for that trouble!

Post by **jackhyq** » Mon, 20 Apr 2009, 20:53

woody wrote: Hi Jackhyq,

my EV will be around 640 Volts nominal (224 cells in series) and range isn't that big a deal for me, so the ideal cell for me would be:

10-20Ah cell
>=30A continuous discharge
>=150A peak/pulse discharge for 10 seconds
>=5C continuous charge
>=100A pulse charge (10 seconds)
low internal resistance (2-4 mOhm equivalent series resistance)
good cycle life even with good moderate discharge (e.g. 2000+ cycles of 80% depth of discharge)

Do you have any cells of this spec or close?

cheers,
Woody

PS: Any response will be posted here, I will be happy if you do it directly

Hi ,
I don't know you are Woody or Mathieu .
i must confirm one information with you ,how about your whole pack's capacity ? maybe you forget to say that .

Post by **gpsnettrack** » Tue, 21 Apr 2009, 19:14

Are they the same sites or company ????

www.ponilion.com = [ 203.191.149.17 ]

(Asked whois.paycenter.com.cn:43 about ponilion.com)

Domain Name      : ponilion.com
PunnyCode        : ponilion.com
Registrant:
   Organization   : jason
   Name           : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
Administrative Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com
Technical Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com
Billing Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com

Post by **gpsnettrack** » Tue, 21 Apr 2009, 19:15

www.ponilion.org = [ 209.85.84.165 ]

(Asked whois.pir.org:43 about ponilion.org)

Domain ID: D152453944-LROR
Domain Name: PONILION.ORG
Created On: 18-Apr-2008 02: 51: 12 UTC
Last Updated On: 20-Apr-2009 23: 19: 17 UTC
Expiration Date: 18-Apr-2010 02: 51: 12 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar: OnlineNIC Inc. (R64-LROR)
Status: CLIENT UPDATE PROHIBITED
Status: AUTORENEWPERIOD
Registrant ID: ONLC-3244949-4
Registrant Name: xiansheng huang
Registrant Organization: Ponilion Intek Co. Ltd
Registrant Street1: Rm25 Today Bldg Luohu District shenzhen China
Registrant Street2: Rm25 Today Bldg Luohu District shenzhen China
Registrant Street3:
Registrant City: shenzhen
Registrant State/Province: guangdong
Registrant Postal Code: 200001
Registrant Country: CN
Registrant Phone: 86.075581129515
Registrant Phone Ext.: 1111
Registrant FAX: 86.075525432264
Registrant FAX Ext.:
Registrant Email: domain@diyworld.com
Admin ID: ONLC-3244949-1
Admin Name: Domain Master
Admin Organization: DIYSite.com Limited
Admin Street1: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Admin Street2: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Admin Street3:
Admin City: Kowloon
Admin State/Province: Hong Kong
Admin Postal Code: HK
Admin Country: HK
Admin Phone: 852.26260909
Admin Phone Ext.: 1111
Admin FAX: 852.26260404
Admin FAX Ext.:
Admin Email: domain@diyworld.com
Tech ID: ONLC-3244949-2
Tech Name: Domain Master
Tech Organization: DIYSite.com Limited
Tech Street1: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Tech Street2: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Tech Street3:
Tech City: Kowloon
Tech State/Province: Hong Kong
Tech Postal Code: HK
Tech Country: HK
Tech Phone: 852.26260909
Tech Phone Ext.: 1111
Tech FAX: 852.26260404
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email: domain@diyworld.com
Name Server: NS2.ONLINENIC.NET
Name Server: NS3.ONLINENIC.NET
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:

Post by **jackhyq** » Tue, 21 Apr 2009, 21:19

gpsnettrack wrote: Are they the same sites or company ????

www.ponilion.com = [ 203.191.149.17 ]

(Asked whois.paycenter.com.cn:43 about ponilion.com)

Domain Name      : ponilion.com
PunnyCode        : ponilion.com
Registrant:
   Organization   : jason
   Name           : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
Administrative Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com
Technical Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com
Billing Contact:
   Name           : jack
   Organization   : jack
   Address        : shenzhen
   City           : shenzhen
   Province/State : guangdong
   Country        : CN
   Postal Code    : 518019
   Phone Number   : 86-755-81173235
   Fax            : 86-755-25432264
   Email          : batteryshow@126.com

Yes, it is correct.

Post by **jackhyq** » Tue, 21 Apr 2009, 21:20

gpsnettrack wrote:
www.ponilion.org = [ 209.85.84.165 ]

(Asked whois.pir.org:43 about ponilion.org)

Domain ID: D152453944-LROR
Domain Name: PONILION.ORG
Created On: 18-Apr-2008 02: 51: 12 UTC
Last Updated On: 20-Apr-2009 23: 19: 17 UTC
Expiration Date: 18-Apr-2010 02: 51: 12 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar: OnlineNIC Inc. (R64-LROR)
Status: CLIENT UPDATE PROHIBITED
Status: AUTORENEWPERIOD
Registrant ID: ONLC-3244949-4
Registrant Name: xiansheng huang
Registrant Organization: Ponilion Intek Co. Ltd
Registrant Street1: Rm25 Today Bldg Luohu District shenzhen China
Registrant Street2: Rm25 Today Bldg Luohu District shenzhen China
Registrant Street3:
Registrant City: shenzhen
Registrant State/Province: guangdong
Registrant Postal Code: 200001
Registrant Country: CN
Registrant Phone: 86.075581129515
Registrant Phone Ext.: 1111
Registrant FAX: 86.075525432264
Registrant FAX Ext.:
Registrant Email: domain@diyworld.com
Admin ID: ONLC-3244949-1
Admin Name: Domain Master
Admin Organization: DIYSite.com Limited
Admin Street1: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Admin Street2: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Admin Street3:
Admin City: Kowloon
Admin State/Province: Hong Kong
Admin Postal Code: HK
Admin Country: HK
Admin Phone: 852.26260909
Admin Phone Ext.: 1111
Admin FAX: 852.26260404
Admin FAX Ext.:
Admin Email: domain@diyworld.com
Tech ID: ONLC-3244949-2
Tech Name: Domain Master
Tech Organization: DIYSite.com Limited
Tech Street1: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Tech Street2: Unit 109 Building 7 Hong Kong Science Park Shatin Hong Kong
Tech Street3:
Tech City: Kowloon
Tech State/Province: Hong Kong
Tech Postal Code: HK
Tech Country: HK
Tech Phone: 852.26260909
Tech Phone Ext.: 1111
Tech FAX: 852.26260404
Tech FAX Ext.:
Tech Email: domain@diyworld.com
Name Server: NS2.ONLINENIC.NET
Name Server: NS3.ONLINENIC.NET
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:
Name Server:

yes,it is correct,but i don't know what do you mean ?

Post by **Martin** » Sat, 25 Apr 2009, 18:39

There seems to be something resembling the TS lithiums in a blue colour at http://batteryshow.en.ecplaza.net/1.asp

I had the same problem landing at the ponilion site, but this one had their products anyway.

Still waiting to hear on specs, (& prices).

Post by **Martin** » Sun, 26 Apr 2009, 03:17

Are the BYD batteries in the ballpark pricewise?

As usual, getting details is a grey area.

http://www.auto88.cz/forum/showthread.php?t=13

Post by **HeadsUp** » Sun, 26 Apr 2009, 04:56

Jack

can you show us any photos of your factory ?

cheers

Post by **coulomb** » Sun, 26 Apr 2009, 05:19

Martin wrote: Are the BYD batteries in the ballpark pricewise?

My understanding is that the BYD batteries are not for sale except to magacorporations. Or maybe not even them. Even though they are essentially a battery company that has branched out into EVs, to use their own high power batteries.

I think those photos of the pretty cells were just part of a "this is how it works" display.

I like this photo from a page linked from one Martin supplied:

We need machines like this at every Woolworths

Post by **Richo** » Thu, 25 Jun 2009, 04:58

Hope no one invested in Poniloin batteries as they seem to have disappeared off the face of the planet.

Post by **coulomb** » Thu, 25 Jun 2009, 05:05

Well, they seem to have let http://www.ponilion.com (popup alert) expire. Not a good sign, but then Chinese companies don't seem to set much store by a good, factual web site, do they?

There is still http://batteryshow.en.ecplaza.net/1.asp, but of course this is just one of those portal things.

Post by **maximus-racing** » Tue, 18 Aug 2009, 08:26

Hi All !
I am french distributor of lifepo4 batteries.
Beware of this "non existing" company !!!

I first test one lifepo4 battery pack that was very good and 26650 cells that was great too.
I've bought several e-bike packs following to the good test (last summer 2008). (36V10Ah to 48V20Ah)
From this time I only have problems with a lot of bad packs.
Some are good and I don't have any news from clients and some give me many troubles !!!
Either few cells dead after 2/3 cycles (sometimes cannot be used one time !!!), either BMS fail.
I succeeded to get some replacement packs MONTHES and replacement packs are dead too !
I had claim to be refound for one bad pack with high rate 26650 cells, but on the 50 cells I've got, half had burnt in the parcel (???), and the good cells was only low discharge cells (fraud on the goods).
I think this guy doesn't reprensent any "big" company but only buy second hands material and try to make business and try to mislaed clients over the world...
No replies to my complains, no solutions, no refound....
He only can say "I told my engineers", "sorry", etc...
welcome,other problems ,i am still pushing
Battery,(L)Jack_Huang_...常活跃! Maximus engineers must confirm that situation and need more docs and signatures ,so it is trouble for me to push whole process,i hope sometimes you can understand me and support me ,
etc, etc....and can cut and past full MSN conversations with this kind of talking....
If you want to have problems, buy to him !!!
Cheers
Maximus

[ Edited Coulomb: Repaired bad Unicode chars in preparation for conversion to phpBB ]

Post by **Richo** » Tue, 18 Aug 2009, 08:39

No Poniloin don't exist any more.

Post by **HeadsUp** » Tue, 18 Aug 2009, 15:12

interestink

maybe his company existed only as a letterhead and he will pop up somewhere else with a different name .

sux ath bugtime duznit

ps , if anybody finds it useful , i know an aussie guy in beijing who has lived there for years and his business is investigating products and suppliers for western markets.

usually only deals with bigger businesses ,..... but if anybody has questions re sourcing , i can ask him if he is interested in chatting with you

Post by **jewar** » Wed, 26 Aug 2009, 17:41

It's better to buy cells from big companies. Based on my knowledge, there are three big players at China: BYD, BAK, and TS.

Post by **jackhyq** » Sat, 29 Aug 2009, 22:17

maximus-racing wrote: Hi All !
I am french distributor of lifepo4 batteries.
Beware of this "non existing" company !!!
I first test one lifepo4 battery pack that was very good and 26650 cells that was great too.
I've bought several e-bike packs following to the good test (last summer 2008). (36V10Ah to 48V20Ah)
From this time I only have problems with a lot of bad packs.
Some are good and I don't have any news from clients and some give me many troubles !!!
Either few cells dead after 2/3 cycles (sometimes cannot be used one time !!!), either BMS fail.
I succeeded to get some replacement packs MONTHES and replacement packs are dead too !
I had claim to be refound for one bad pack with high rate 26650 cells, but on the 50 cells I've got, half had burnt in the parcel (???), and the good cells was only low discharge cells (fraud on the goods).
I think this guy doesn't reprensent any "big" company but only buy second hands material and try to make business and try to mislaed clients over the world...
No replies to my complains, no solutions, no refound....
He only can say "I told my engineers", "sorry", etc...
welcome,other problems ,i am still pushing
Battery,(L)Jack_Huang_...常活跃! Maximus engineers must confirm that situation and need more docs and signatures ,so it is trouble for me to push whole process,i hope sometimes you can understand me and support me ,
etc, etc....and can cut and past full MSN conversations with this kind of talking....
If you want to have problems, buy to him !!!
Cheers
Maximus

What do you want to do ? I had tried my best to coordinate with our company and had replace new packs to you for free including packs+shipping cost ,why you always appeared bad packs ? why other clients no bad pack to respond ? i am still fuzzled about them. And now you try this kind of way to denigrate me or our company , do you think it is funny thing ? I retain our rights too !

[ Edited Coulomb: Repaired bad Unicode chars in preparation for conversion to phpBB ]

Post by **jackhyq** » Sat, 29 Aug 2009, 22:27

jewar wrote: It's better to buy cells from big companies. Based on my knowledge, there are three big players at China: BYD, BAK, and TS.

hehe, that's great advice. BYD,they would like to cooperate with Car factories or other bigger companies too,and they use LiFePo4 batteries for themself,from my personal ,i think they don't sell large scale in the market. BAK as i know they just produce the cylindrical cells ,mainly for aluminium li-ion battery although they had machines and product lines. TS i think more people know this company , mass quantity with good price ... . So every guys ,thanks for your attention about me and our company , and we are solving the website things asap!(domain name had problems with register because our net engineer's mistake). thanks all guys again.

Post by **maximus-racing** » Sat, 29 Aug 2009, 23:35

jackhyq wrote: What do you want to do ? I had tried my best to coordinate with our company and had replace new packs to you for free including packs+shipping cost ,why you always appeared bad packs ? why other clients no bad pack to respond ? i am still fuzzled about them. And now you try this kind of way to denigrate me or our company , do you think it is funny thing ? I retain our rights too !

Just see that for new problem again with your "good" batteries...

Original text"de : "bernard cottignies" <cottignies.bernard@wanadoo.fr> à : maximus-rc@orange.fr date : 14/08/09 23:36 objet : batteries 48v 20AH,HS voir l'en-tête complet From: "bernard cottignies" <cottignies.bernard@wanadoo.fr> To: <maximus-rc@orange.fr> Subject: batteries 48v 20AH,HS Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2009 23:36:12 +0200
Bonjour, Malheureusement et à mon grand désespoir, j’ai de nouveau des problèmes avec ma nouvelle batterie,elle charge bien à 60voltsmais elle retombe très vite à 52volts à vide avant utilisation et à 49 ou 50volts dès qu’on l’utilise et l’autonomie est très faible environ 50 à 60kms avant les premières coupures BMS.C’est vraiment désespérant ce manque de fiabilité ,je fais beaucoup plus de kms avec une batterie bricolée avec les batteries HS que vous m’avez revendues et je faisais plus du double de kms avec ma première batterie avant qu’elle ne me lâche aussi . Qu’elles solutions me proposez vous ? Chaque batterie aura fonctionné correctement moins d’un mois, j’ai du attendre 6 mois la 2eme sous garantie ,je n’ai nullement envie d’attendre aussi longtemps que ce nouveau problème soit résolu et de toute façon je n’ai plus aucune confiance dans ce modèle de batterie. Etant donné le manque total de fiabilité de ce modèle (confirmé sur le forum) ne pourriez-vous pas me le remplacer pour la garantie par un pack A 123 d’un prix équivalent à savoir 48v 11.5AH qui parait être beaucoup plus fiable . Cordialement. B.Cottignies.

Tranlation

Hello, Unfortunately and much to my despair, I again have problems with my new battery, it loads well 60voltsmais it falls quickly to 52volts vacuum before use and 49 or 50volts when it is used and autonomy is very low about 50 to 60kms before the first cuts BMS.C is really desperate this lack of reliability, I do a lot more miles with a makeshift battery with battery HS you sold me and I was more than double kms with my first battery before it lets go of me too. Solutions that you offer me? Each battery will function properly within a month, I had to wait 6 months the 2nd under warranty, I did not want to wait as long as this problem is solved again and anyway I have no confidence in the battery model. Given the lack of reliability of this model (confirmed on the forum) could you not replace me for a Warranty A 123 pack of a price equivalent to 48v 11.5AH know who seems to be much more reliable. Best regards. B. Cottignies.

I suppose you will not refound me ???
I shall have to make that or provide better battery than your , with this client....
Maximus

Post by **jackhyq** » Sat, 29 Aug 2009, 23:52

maximus-racing wrote:
jackhyq wrote: What do you want to do ? I had tried my best to coordinate with our company and had replace new packs to you for free including packs+shipping cost ,why you always appeared bad packs ? why other clients no bad pack to respond ? i am still fuzzled about them. And now you try this kind of way to denigrate me or our company , do you think it is funny thing ? I retain our rights too !
Just see that for new problem again with your "good" batteries...

Original text"de : "bernard cottignies" <cottignies.bernard@wanadoo.fr> à : maximus-rc@orange.fr date : 14/08/09 23:36 objet : batteries 48v 20AH,HS voir l'en-tête complet From: "bernard cottignies" <cottignies.bernard@wanadoo.fr> To: <maximus-rc@orange.fr> Subject: batteries 48v 20AH,HS Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2009 23:36:12 +0200
Bonjour, Malheureusement et à mon grand désespoir, j’ai de nouveau des problèmes avec ma nouvelle batterie,elle charge bien à 60voltsmais elle retombe très vite à 52volts à vide avant utilisation et à 49 ou 50volts dès qu’on l’utilise et l’autonomie est très faible environ 50 à 60kms avant les premières coupures BMS.C’est vraiment désespérant ce manque de fiabilité ,je fais beaucoup plus de kms avec une batterie bricolée avec les batteries HS que vous m’avez revendues et je faisais plus du double de kms avec ma première batterie avant qu’elle ne me lâche aussi . Qu’elles solutions me proposez vous ? Chaque batterie aura fonctionné correctement moins d’un mois, j’ai du attendre 6 mois la 2eme sous garantie ,je n’ai nullement envie d’attendre aussi longtemps que ce nouveau problème soit résolu et de toute façon je n’ai plus aucune confiance dans ce modèle de batterie. Etant donné le manque total de fiabilité de ce modèle (confirmé sur le forum) ne pourriez-vous pas me le remplacer pour la garantie par un pack A 123 d’un prix équivalent à savoir 48v 11.5AH qui parait être beaucoup plus fiable . Cordialement. B.Cottignies.

Tranlation

Hello, Unfortunately and much to my despair, I again have problems with my new battery, it loads well 60voltsmais it falls quickly to 52volts vacuum before use and 49 or 50volts when it is used and autonomy is very low about 50 to 60kms before the first cuts BMS.C is really desperate this lack of reliability, I do a lot more miles with a makeshift battery with battery HS you sold me and I was more than double kms with my first battery before it lets go of me too. Solutions that you offer me? Each battery will function properly within a month, I had to wait 6 months the 2nd under warranty, I did not want to wait as long as this problem is solved again and anyway I have no confidence in the battery model. Given the lack of reliability of this model (confirmed on the forum) could you not replace me for a Warranty A 123 pack of a price equivalent to 48v 11.5AH know who seems to be much more reliable. Best regards. B. Cottignies.

I suppose you will not refound me ???
I shall have to make that or provide better battery than your , with this client....
Maximus

I know it is hard to solve for you ,from my personal ,it is warmhearted and sincere to do business with you ,but other situation i can't control ,i hope you can understand that ,ok ? do you remmeber that ?Last time actually i had tried my best to replace new packs to you freely and shipping to you freely .