Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

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sparau
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by sparau »

Just saying hello so i am not a complete lurker while i soak up information :)

I have a 205gti i recently bought for bugger all (first car i've owned in 15 years, dedicated motorcyclist and public transporter :)) - good body - interior is ok - gbox is ok - but has worn valve stems... so rather than spend $400- to fix the engine im thinking $14,000 to turn it electric seems sensible Image

ah like i read here it has been a dream of mine since i was 17 (and im about to turn 40...) so i'm going to see if i can come up with the coin to do it.

At this point im trying to work out whether a warp 9 will give enough go go fun with a pack of 160 ts li-ions through the original gearbox. Awaiting hearing how zeva's 11 goes in the mx5, but really thats going to be outside my budget.
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woody
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by woody »

Hi Sparau + Welcome,

I like the 205gti too. :-)

I think with a front-wheel drive, you'll have lots of trouble going direct drive, and a Warp 11 will bend your gearbox, so Warp 9 looks like the sensible way forward if you like DC. Impulse 9 if the Warp doesn't fit, but take a look at the Advanced DC 9s too.

I like AC drives, but I don't think anyone has finished one which isn't direct drive except perhaps Kermit the Car

cheers,
Woody
Planned EV: '63 Cortina using AC and LiFePO4 Battery Pack
sparau
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by sparau »

woody wrote:and a Warp 11 will bend your gearbox


!!@! Wow - i havent been able to find torque figures (google warp 9 dyno electric) for anything over 72v as listed on the manufacturers site. I had guessed since people bolt on 160hp 16v engines onto 205's without difficulty such issues would be moot.

Also - stupid brain - i had thought the TS160's were $200- each not ~$360- !!! I have been researching making an electric performance bike for a while and started thinking that for the cost and pain i might as well look at a car since i just do a boring freeway commute to work and back (and ##@$#@# stupid govt, the public transport here on the sunny coast is WOEFUL)

but $14-K for batteries alone is kinda scaring me !!

i need to do the math on what i would save over the petrol costs - while i would dearly love to just do it anyway - reality is with mortgage and children i have to work out if i can do it...
sparau
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by sparau »

btw - sorry this post should have been in the general area i suppose Image   i just got excited looking at the posts here and people talking about a 205 conversion - admins feel free to move it.
Andrew
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by Andrew »

No worries sparau - topic moved.
Oh and welcome! Image
juk
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by juk »

Yeah Go the 205 GTi conversion.

The 205 GTi runs the same gearbox as the 405 Mi16 and is well known to be a very tough gearbox. One bloke in WA put a Mi16 engine in a 205 and did a little extra work to the engine, the trouble he had was not with the strength of the gearbox, but with the drive shafts of which he snapped a couple and ended up running custom drive shafts.

He also had to upgrade the brakes twice.
AMPrentice
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by AMPrentice »

sparau wrote: Just saying hello so i am not a complete lurker while i soak up information :)

I have a 205gti i recently bought for bugger all (first car i've owned in 15 years, dedicated motorcyclist and public transporter :)) - good body - interior is ok - gbox is ok - but has worn valve stems... so rather than spend $400- to fix the engine im thinking $14,000 to turn it electric seems sensible Image

ah like i read here it has been a dream of mine since i was 17 (and im about to turn 40...) so i'm going to see if i can come up with the coin to do it.

At this point im trying to work out whether a warp 9 will give enough go go fun with a pack of 160 ts li-ions through the original gearbox. Awaiting hearing how zeva's 11 goes in the mx5, but really thats going to be outside my budget.


welcome! 205 is a well built car, too well built actually for its size.
Alot of weight on the doors and hatch but its surely a quality car. I would start with asking what distance are you looking at and how many passengers?
Otherwise it could be worth going to a smaller car like a daihatsu mira or suzi hatch. Even a Matiz which is very aerodynamic.
The pug motor is very light being pressure die cast alloy and little savings are made with these cars in that departmet.
A small car running a 72 volts system is cheap and practical. Look up doctor larry with his 72v geo metro of swift in the evalbum.com search option.
Last edited by AMPrentice on Wed, 17 Sep 2008, 08:03, edited 1 time in total.
juk
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by juk »

I'm going to go ahead and pretend you didn't mention Daihatsu Mira, suziki swift or heaven forbid a Daewoo as an alternative to a Peugeot 205 GTi.

The whole car had a kerb weight of 880 kg, and the pommie model with lower emmission control and lacking the power steering weighed less than 800kg.

I've taken the liberty of copying the section on the "Car of the Decade" from wikipedia, and remarkably, there's no mention of the Daewoo:

205 GTI


Peugeot 205 GTI
The GTI version came in 1.6-litre and 1.9-litre, in-line four cylinder configurations, and is considered to be among the most popular hot hatches of the era. Compared to modern cars they can be tricky to handle, due to their tendency towards rather sudden lift-off oversteer during hard cornering, and a complete absence of electronic driver aids. However once mastered, or in the hands of a skilled driver, these cars are still known to offer a very rewarding driving experience. The 205 GTI was certainly one of the first front wheel drive cars said by many motoring experts to be as rewarding to drive hard as an equivalent rear-wheel drive car.
The 1.6 GTI came with a XU5J engine, producing 105 bhp DIN (77 kW), for the 1987 model year the XU5J received the cylinder head with larger valves from the 1.9 GTI's XU9JA engine thus becoming XU5JA. The new engine was quoted for 115 bhp (85 kW). The 1.9 GTI came with an XU9JA engine producing 128 bhp (95 kW) DIN (96 kW), although later models with a catalytic converter produced 122 bhp (91 kW) DIN (89 kW). Internally these engines are very similar, the main differences on 1.9-litre versions being the longer stroke, oil cooler, and some parts of the fuel injection system. The shorter stroke 1.6-litre engine is famed for being revvy and eager, while the 1.9-litre feels lazier and torquier. Outside the engine bay the main differences between the 1.6 GTI and the 1.9 GTI are half-leather seats (1.9 GTI) vs. cloth seats (1.6 GTI); and disc brakes all-round (1.9 GTI) vs. discs at the front and drum brakes at the back (1.6 GTI); as well as the 14 inch alloy wheels (1.6 GTI) vs. 15 inch alloys (1.9 GTI).
The 205 is still mentioned to this day in group car tests of the newest GTI models or equivalent. Peugeot itself has never truly recreated this success in future GTI models, although came very close with the highly regarded GTI-6 variant of the Peugeot 306. A cabriolet version of the 205, known as the CJ (or CT in France), was designed and partially assembled by Pininfarina of Italy. A CTi version, with the same plastic arches and wheels as the 1.6 GTI was also available. Some later models incorporated the catalysed 1.9 engine.
The main aesthetic difference between the GTI/CTi versions and other 205 models were the plastic wheel arches and trim, beefier front and rear bumper valances. The shell also underwent some minor changes, including larger wheel arches (to suit the larger wheels on the GTI and CTi), and the suspension was redesigned and sat lower on the GTI with stiffer springs, different wishbones and a drop-linked arb.
With the early success of the 205 GTI in Europe, Motor Trend reported in 1984 that Peugeot was seriously considering adding it to its. U.S lineup, even though Peugeot had a more upmarket image in the United States. Nothing ever came of such rumours, however, and any talk of Peugeot expanding its presence in U.S. became moot when it was forced to pull out in 1991.
Sales of the GTI in the early 1990s were badly hit by soaring insurance premiums, brought about by high theft and 'joyriding' of cars of this sort. Increasingly stringent emissions regulations meant the 1.6GTI went out of production in 1992, while the 1.9 was sold for a couple more years thanks to re-engineering of the engine to enable it to work properly with a catalytic converter.
A common modification for fast road/track use is to transplant a Peugeot/Citroen MI-16 engine and ECU (XU9J4 Type D6C), as used in Citroen BX 19GTI 16V and the Peugeot 405Mi16. This is a development of the 205 1.9GTI engine, the essential difference is the 16-valve double overhead camshaft cylinder head. The engine will just fit into the small Peugeot's engine bay with a few adjustments (principally to provide the necessary clearance between the exhaust manifold and the firewall), the method of installation varies depending on how professionally it is installed - often the bonnet from an automatic model is used, as they had a distinctive centre bulge found in no other variant. Weight gains are negligible, and the rise in power (160bhp, up from 130bhp) is startling in so light a car. Less common and also less reliable is the practice of turbocharging or even supercharging the standard XU 8-valve unit. Over 200 bhp has been achieved from a standard engine with the correct fuelling using this method. More may be available, although the usual turbo problems of high exhaust temperatures, detonation and turbine lag will inevitably creep in.

AMPrentice
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by AMPrentice »

I used own 2 of them and sold a treasured 16valve head recently hoping that one day Id buy another and do an LPG 16valve GTi. So dont really need a wiki splurge Image

Since you said you cycled I thought that even a Daewoo Matiz (re-badged suzuki) was an upgrade, cheaper on batteries, more aerodynamic and cheaper for parts. Compare the 205 to the jap bento boxes without ICE gear and theres about 200-300kg in difference as gliders.

Hey no insult intended just an observation for bigger savings and performance.
If you like RWD like many do as its easier to handle the torque.
Most of the jap buzzboxes convert to RWD as many came out as 4wds.
Disconnecting the 4wd system to 2WD and make nice direct drive conversions.

Either way if I could afford batteries also I wouldnt mind a 205GTI Image
There are heaps of aftermarket bits for them too, CF doors and hatch at
30 per cent of original weight. Also heaps of alloy suspension bits.
Last edited by AMPrentice on Thu, 18 Sep 2008, 07:21, edited 1 time in total.
sparau
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by sparau »

lol - no insult to me Image considering i havent owned a car for 15 years and this one's still a bit of a bomb i really dont have much in the way of brand loyalty...

However years ago i rebuilt a few old cars and spent a fair bit of time cruising wrecking yards. I did notice a nasty trend that the light weight asian cars tended to "lose their shape" somewhat in accidents resulting in the carpets of them often being filled with dried dark liquids...

my wife had a bitsash*tty colt when i met her - once a push bike rider ran into the door, swinging it around front - he got up said oops (he just swished around a corner) and rode off.

the "intrusion" bars fell off the door, it bent 15 degrees in the middle, the A pillar twisted, the guard and chassis under the guard bent and distorted, the panel in front of the windscreen bent...

so i got out me trusty dolly and hammer and attempted to straighten it... the metal just stretched so badly with the hammer i found it was easier to just push out the dints with my thumb... i've felt coke cans that are stronger than it was.

not that i am really a safety nazi (i've had my current bike on it's back wheel at 170kmh) but i'll stick with the pug Image
AMPrentice
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Hello and "Yeah, go the 205 GTi conversion!"

Post by AMPrentice »

smug as a pug in an electric rug. Image
Last edited by AMPrentice on Thu, 18 Sep 2008, 19:05, edited 1 time in total.
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