Orientation of Batteries

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photomac
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by photomac » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 17:24

Hello all and thanks,

In trying to distribute Thundersky batteries about a car I had hoped to lay them on their side.
I have had mixed commentary about the appropriateness of doing so.
I have only just fired off an email to TS and await their response.

What experiences / comments can you share please.

Cheers
Matthew

ps For this reason I have secured dimensions and specs for LiBatOz cells. Their energy/weight/form factor is promising.
Last edited by photomac on Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 06:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by Johny » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 17:36

I don't have any first hand experience but this has come up before - here or on DIY Electric Cars - I forget which.
Anyway. The consensus last time was that it is inadvisable from the point of view that the vent caps are on the top. If the electrolyte flows then it is possible that the cell could expel "goo" if it is overcharge/discharged. The odd gassing is OK, not the odd "gooing".

Found it

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Orientation of Batteries

Post by photomac » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 17:58

Thanks Johny!
Gooing not good!
Mmmmm - let me drill some holes and pipe the goo away - I think not   Image
Cheers
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by acmotor » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 18:19

TS have already responded on this topic to Nevilleh.
Answer is LFP cells are designed for vertical only but a horizontal version can be made for extra cost.

The reason is examined here .

Quite a few people have mounted liquid filled LiFePO4 cells horizontally. Whilst this is not correct from either manufacturer's advice or intuition on examination, I have not had direct feedback of failures attributable to the H mounting. But then it is early days.   Image
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by Nevilleh » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 18:21

I asked them that same question and the reply was that they must stand up. BUT, for a small extra fee, like $10 per cell, they could supply cells that could be laid on their side. I just swiched to using 3 x 40 AH in parallel instead of the bigger ones as they are short enough to fit where I wanted to put them. And I went to Sky Energy as well.


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Orientation of Batteries

Post by acmotor » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 18:44

Hmmm, both SE and TS factory say upright only. Physical examination of contents and vent suggests upright. Clearly some people are 'getting away' with horizontal.
Some salesmen will tell you any orientation !
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by Johny » Thu, 26 Nov 2009, 18:52

For $10 per cell they may well fill in the vent and re-drill and mount another vent on the side. A bit wishy-washy if it vents while you are going up/down a hill (vent on long side of cell) - sort of likely too.

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Orientation of Batteries

Post by photomac » Mon, 30 Nov 2009, 22:35

Just received a second, confirming reply from Thundersky about Battery orientation. Without a quoted price, at this stage, it is possible to make a special order of appropriate positioning of the "ooze" valve. So - it is feasible to lay the batteries on the flat or edge for an underfloor distribution. Naturally with appropriate physical protection.
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by coulomb » Tue, 01 Dec 2009, 02:32

Aha. So it sounds like even if you have Thunder Sky cells that are OK to install on their sides, there will still be a vent on the side (which now becomes the top of the cell). So this is (if I understand correctly) a nono:

Image

Some of these kits are actually supplied with Mottcell cells, which don't seem to have a vent like Thunder Sky or Sky Energy cells:

Image

There may be some other sort of vent under that orange logo, but it seems unlikely. These are also installed on their sides, but perhaps they have no vent, and therefore are OK for horizontal mounting.
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Orientation of Batteries

Post by photomac » Tue, 01 Dec 2009, 03:09

Neat job!
Regards to a no-no it sounds like it is preferable not to leave the vent on the side.

Unfortunately this is beyond my experience and knowledge.

Looking at the Mottcell - a wild guess - the "valve" could be in the terminal construction.

If the unit is sealed and a goo is produced I would suspect an internal swelling will occur causing a possible rupture of the housing.

I've got a feeling looking at the seal on the Thundersky a leak is not anticipated during most of the cells "normal" life.

Goo runs downwards so if the leak can escape safely then minimal damage would occur. However - more of the electrolyte will be lost.

The fact taht Thundersky do the modification indicates an issue exists, or they are just keeping the buyer's concern satisfied?

Cheers
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