AVASS Battery order details

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reecho
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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by reecho » Mon, 06 Aug 2018, 19:51

Gobopolice wrote:
Sun, 05 Aug 2018, 18:12
Whats the size of the Goodwe SBP you scored
The 5Kw version.

I think I have managed to stumble on the CAN BUS protocols. As you would expect it looks like they have copied Sunny Boy's Island product, just with a few changes.


Why am I not surprised.. :-)

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by lobster » Mon, 06 Aug 2018, 21:46

reecho wrote:
Mon, 06 Aug 2018, 19:51

I think I have managed to stumble on the CAN BUS protocols. As you would expect it looks like they have copied Sunny Boy's Island product, just with a few changes. Why am I not surprised.. :-)
Hi Richard,
I was discussing these inverter Can bus protocols with an engineer friend recently. He mentioned that SMA were forced by the German Govt to put the protocols on public domain if they wanted German consumers to continue to receive subsidies for their products. I "believe" this is now known as SunSpec ModBus and has to be used with Demand Response Enabled Modes for manufacturers to obtain international certification.

The Goodwe SBP 5000 is looks well specified and priced. I hope you can find a way to use these protocols to interface with generic BMS systems.

Cheers, Steve
Last edited by rhills on Mon, 06 Aug 2018, 22:20, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Edited by Admin to fix up quoting of previous post

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by slim » Sat, 18 Aug 2018, 19:24

Hi

Just joined this forum due to this thread :-)

I have enphase 10kw Micro inverter system and want to retrofit batteries and have discovered the GoodWe SBP series as one of the only grid tied retro fit inverters suitable.

Was hoping to use Batrium bms but would consider others to.

I have been researching batteries and will end up buying when I find the right deal. I’m exporting 30kw a day atm in winter so the bigger my pack the better :-)

Anyway, I’ll stay watching to see if anyone has any luck with the GoodWe.

FYI the Batrium talks LG resu, and I believe the GoodWe does to, so it may already work, but of course no one can confirm or deny if it actually works!

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by dgh853 » Sun, 19 Aug 2018, 07:21

There has been some progress with Goodwe SBP talking via CAN to the Batrium Watchmon using the SMA Sunny Island protocol but the CAN messages stop after a couple of minutes. There are more details and progress updates on the AEVA Cell Mates facebook group.
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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by slim » Sun, 19 Aug 2018, 07:29

Thanks - I will check it out.

Note: it was Batrium themselves that mentioned LGResu compatibility.. maybe using that protocol, rather than sunnyboy will yield better results.

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by dgh853 » Sun, 19 Aug 2018, 16:31

With the Batrium BMS you select compatibility with a battery inverter eg. you select the preferred protocol from a list including SMA Sunny Island 3.1, Victron Color Control GX, Solax etc. There is no Goodwe inverter option yet, we are trying to work out whether a new one is needed or whether we can reuse an existing one.

In the Goodwe inverter you select what battery type you have - lead acid / self-define, BYD B-Box, LG Chem Resu 6.4 EX etc. So the inverter needs to be configured to use a battery type which will send/receive CAN packets and secondly the Batrium BMS needs to send CAN messages that follow the protocols understood by the inverter.

So you need to set both correctly to make it work eg. SMA Sunny Island 3.1 and LG Chem Resu 6.4Ex. Whether that is the correct combination is what is being tested. It could be a different battery or different protocol or something else again.
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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by slim » Sun, 19 Aug 2018, 17:29

Yeah, if the inverter and the Batrium properly supports a given protocol then it should work.

I guess both Batrium and the inverter have issues with the various protocols. It will be finding the combination of the most compatible. (Painful)

You’d think inverter manufacturers would be all over this.

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by mark_hetho » Mon, 20 Aug 2018, 08:21

I had a look at some of the Goodwe SBP 5000 spec sheets. It does have a lot of configurations listed as unsupported (generator on AC side, connecting backup side to grid etc).

I'm wondering if it can DC couple to solar panels. The closest I can see in the user manual is "one battery bank cannot be connected to multi inverters". I guess this may depend more on if the BMS can manage both charging sources in a meaningful way?

(NB:I'm now leaning toward a more economical solution as the charger in my I-Miev might be going to require some funds!)

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by dgh853 » Tue, 21 Aug 2018, 06:15

mark_hetho wrote:
Mon, 20 Aug 2018, 08:21
I had a look at some of the Goodwe SBP 5000 spec sheets. It does have a lot of configurations listed as unsupported (generator on AC side, connecting backup side to grid etc).

I'm wondering if it can DC couple to solar panels. The closest I can see in the user manual is "one battery bank cannot be connected to multi inverters". I guess this may depend more on if the BMS can manage both charging sources in a meaningful way?

(NB:I'm now leaning toward a more economical solution as the charger in my I-Miev might be going to require some funds!)
The Goodwe SBP series are designed for grid connected AC coupled for retro-fit to an existing solar PV system. They don't have the flexibility of the more sophisticated battery inverters like Victron or Selectronic. The Victrons for example you can configure in pretty much any way you like with AC coupled, DC-coupled etc, on-grid, off-grid etc.

The majority of AEVA members with these batteries will be on-grid and already have a grid-connected solar PV system with common AC-DC solar inverter so the Goodwe will be suitable for that most common setup. But they won't be suitable for much else. They do have a hybrid inverter ES5048 for those who will be adding solar.

The Goodwe ES and SBP series are primarily intended to reduce your electricity usage by netting off at the meter box. There are three modes. The main mode is not aware of time of use tariffs etc it just charges during the day and discharges at night or when you're using more power than your panels can provide during the day. It does have a timer mode but it's very simple. You can set one time period where it charges and another time period where it discharges. Any time not covered in these time periods it behaves as in the main mode i.e. tries to net off at the meter. The third mode is just provides battery power to the backup circuit. With that setup I guess it could support a DC-coupled arrangement where the solar panels use a DC charge controller to charge the battery and then the SBP just provides AC power to its backup circuit. I've used mode one and two and they work well with a few limitations.
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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by mark_hetho » Tue, 21 Aug 2018, 06:34

I wasn't actually intending on operating it off grid, I'd probably go for the Victron or Selectronic options for that. However I was thinking thinking in theory if you are DC (solar) charging the batteries, and the BMS is telling it there is plenty of energy it would continue to support loads to net off at the meter while ever that was the case. The main issues I would see with that is that if it is trying to charge at the same time as the DC feeds in from the solar you'd potentially have an excessive charge current for the batteries.

All in all it makes much more sense to look at the ES5048 to allow for solar in the future, assuming the pricing isn't much different (I can see some pricing on the SBP 5000, but haven't seen any for the ES5048). I'll have to look up some spec sheets to try to figure out how it will work with our existing hybrid system. I'm thinking I set it to zero export and it "just works" with our export limit taken up by the current system. While ever the other system is exporting it will charge batteries, then when they are full it would cease solar generation.

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Re: AVASS Battery order details

Post by dgh853 » Tue, 21 Aug 2018, 06:41

And that's the challenge it can't handle - a DC coupled arrangement as it doesn't have visibility of a DC charge controller charging the battery at the same time and you could exceed the 100A charge limit. The Victrons are smart in that way as the DC charge controller and Multigrid etc talk with each other via the Venus / Color Control thingy and make sure they don't go past the total battery charge limit.

Note sure on ES5048 pricing but probably not significantly more than SBP5000 i.e. should be under AUD3000.
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