Crashed my i3 - 9.40pm Sunday 22 Jan

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g4qber
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Crashed my i3 - 9.40pm Sunday 22 Jan

Post by g4qber » Tue, 24 Jan 2017, 17:15

Very Sore sternum. Bruise on right forearm. Minor soreness around right ribs

heading west on ocean reef rd. other. Guy in ute heading east turning right onto Wanneroo rd
Slowed for intersection but was speeding up to get to 80
Guy allegedly went through red arrow
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Post by Rusdy » Tue, 24 Jan 2017, 20:06

Ouch! front end collision then? Sore sternum from the seat-belt? Air-bag deployed? Hope you recover soon!

How's your i3 faring?

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Post by evseaustralia » Tue, 24 Jan 2017, 21:08

so sorry to hear!

Hope you are ok g4qber.

From my experience the i3 is a very well made and safe vehicle, so hopefully everything is able to be repaired pretty quickly for you.
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Post by g4qber » Fri, 14 Apr 2017, 19:45

I3 written off. $$$ going to tango
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Post by TooQik » Fri, 14 Apr 2017, 20:33

I'll be interested to see what caveats / regulations are put on the Tango in Australia.

Given the 4 point harness and roll cage I would expect that a helmet would also be required for road use.

Curious to know how much extra force a side impact would have on the driver given the extra intrusion bars on the doors too. Have they done any impact testing or purely roll over and collision avoidance tests?

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Post by g4qber » Sun, 16 Apr 2017, 14:20

Rick's answers:

I'll be interested to see what caveats / regulations are put on the Tango in Australia.
> I don’t see any reason for there to be any. It’s just a car.

Given the 4 point harness and roll cage I would expect that a helmet would also be required for road use.
> Because it has safer harnesses should not be any reason to require a helmet.

Curious to know how much extra force a side impact would have on the driver given the extra intrusion bars on the doors too. Have they done any impact testing or purely roll over and collision avoidance tests?
> The roll cage was built to FIA racecar regulations for 300+kph cars.
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Post by Richo » Tue, 18 Apr 2017, 20:50

Well I had to look that one up.
http://www.commutercars.com/au/

Specs look interesting.
But DC - really.

So what $$$ are they talking for a Tango $45-50k?

You'd be better off with one of those kit cars from that mob in Willetton.
http://www.southam.com.au/home.html
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Post by Johny » Tue, 18 Apr 2017, 21:02

Richo wrote: Well I had to look that one up.
http://www.commutercars.com/au/

Specs look interesting.
But DC - really.

So what $$$ are they talking for a Tango $45-50k?

You'd be better off with one of those kit cars from that mob in Willetton.
http://www.southam.com.au/home.html
I must be wrong...
"Quantity             Price     Capital Required to meet required volume
1   LV-IPA        $240k USD              50% deposit"

Source: http://www.commutercars.com/au/buy-lease-rent.html

Really utterly not worth it IMO. I agree with Richo. Get a kit car even if you have to get someone else to electrify it (with AC)!

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Post by g4qber » Tue, 18 Apr 2017, 22:48

the whole point is that it is a narrow vehicle.

definitely not worth it, but I believe in supporting the concept.
and being able to park it almost anywhere.
even in an office.
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Post by Richo » Wed, 19 Apr 2017, 20:30

Yes it's a gokart base with a roll cage fairings on top.

Are they skinny enough to actually drive in the door?
In any case at 1.5T it wouldn't be practical to have inside.

Converting a smart car would also be cheaper.
They're not much bigger.

You'll pull more chicks with an open wheeler kit car and top of the line AC system.

Image
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Post by g4qber » Thu, 20 Apr 2017, 12:27

http://commutercars.com/videos.html

I intend to do lane filtering / splitting with it.
https://youtu.be/yUjhtJdbkGw

I also don't want to get wet in the rain.
http://electrifyingtimes.com/ClooneyTango.html
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Post by Richo » Thu, 20 Apr 2017, 20:41

That's an awesome lane splitting video.

WA Road Traffic Code 2000

I did have a sqiz through the regs.
Nothing jumps out to say you can't do it.
Pages 130-147 relate to overtaking.
Maybe part 124. Keeping a safe distance when overtaking.

I'd think a cop would still pull you over just cos it'd be so out of the ordinary.
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Post by mikedufty » Thu, 20 Apr 2017, 21:41

As it has been explained to me lane splitting can technically be legal if you are on the right of the car in your lane. In practice most people drive close to the right hand side of the lane, so even on a motorcycle it is difficult to split without at some point going past someone on their left. Would be even harder in a Tango. I have been given a ticket for "creating an additional lane" or something similar, which I'm not sure is a real offence, but I still got a ticket for it. That particularly annoyed me as I did it to avoid blocking cars behind me when a turn arrow came on. When I started objecting the cop said he could book me for something else instead so I didn't bother.

Lane splitting in a car looks dangerous to me even though I do it on a motorcycle, but not sure if there is really any difference if there is enough room. You will definitely get stuck in those spots where the bike needs to be leaned to one side then the other to get through.

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Post by Johny » Thu, 20 Apr 2017, 21:42

That lane-splitting video has a slight tinge of "suspect" to it. All the cars in the leftmost lane are hugging the left side of their lane. Could it be possible to set this up?

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Post by g4qber » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 03:07

I believe that the cars saw the tango coming and moved to the side
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Post by Adverse Effects » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 15:35

there is about 50 lane changes with out a indicator

you could also be charged with erratic driving

and maby even dangerous driving

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Post by mikedufty » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 18:35

Johny wrote: All the cars in the leftmost lane are hugging the left side of their lane. Could it be possible to set this up?
Pretty sure it is in the US, so its the equivalent of hugging the right side of the lane here, which is pretty common, also makes all the overtakes blatantly illegal.

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Post by Richo » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 20:41

mikedufty wrote: As it has been explained to me lane splitting can technically be legal if you are on the right of the car in your lane. In practice most people drive close to the right hand side of the lane, so even on a motorcycle it is difficult to split without at some point going past someone on their left.


On a multilane road you are allowed to pass on the left.
Part 122 (2).

Ive heard other things like can't lane split unless the traffic is doing under 60kph.
But I don't see these anywhere in the regs.

There are specifics rules to motorbikes in part 130.
But these only apply to 2 wheel vehicles. Not 3 and 4 isn't mentioned.


Basically I can only see the issues as the wording as "safe to do so" in part 121 and "at a safe distance" in part 122.
Interestingly this is superseded in part 109. "Keeping a safe distance.. except when overtaking".

It's all subjective really as there is no definition.
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Post by Richo » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 21:02

Adverse Effects wrote: there is about 50 lane changes without an indicator


Every trip I see drivers that use no indication at all - ever.
Some old people indicate right and turn left.
I blame the PO-leece.
If there was enough enforcement word of mouth would improve others indicating.


It kind of looked like he was using the Tango as a get away car.
You know drive it like you stole it... Image
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Post by bladecar » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 22:45

The one that I would fix if I could is the 'indicate as you start to turn' thing.

A car is coming the other way and you want to turn right, across it's path. It's quite a distance down the road but since it's going straight ahead, you wait for it.   If it had its indicator on to turn left down the street you're going to turn right into, you'd have plenty of time to go first because you know it has to slow down to get around the corner.
So you wait. Then, just before it reaches the corner, the wheel starts to turn and the turn indicator goes on. You've waited forever because the car has been slowing down.

How to fix it? There's no way since the driver never understood why the turn indicator was required (to show intent and to allow planning by other motorists.)

There will be some who will say that you must never cross an oncoming car's path and I'll let them wait.

Edit: Changed 'for' to 'by'
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Post by mikedufty » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 23:18

Richo wrote:

On a multilane road you are allowed to pass on the left.
Part 122 (2).

Only if you are in a separate lane, I'm talking about passing within the same lane.

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Post by g4qber » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 23:21

Reply from Rick:
"
California drivers are aware that lanesplitting is legal and tend to move over to the left. Although there is no regulation saying that it must be done between the two left-most lanes, it is a custom, and drivers are expecting it. Believe me, there was no setup for that lanesplitting video. I did notice a truck driver overreacting, but he didn’t need to move over so far. They’re just being polite. For lanesplitting there is no requirement for using the turn signal, although many years ago I met with the administrative officer of the CHP, way before legislation formally legalized it. He mentioned that one could be cited for not using the turn signal, but even then, the officer said he’d never heard of such a citation. It’s so commonplace in California and most of the rest of the world, that everyone is used to it. The other 49 states, Australia, and New Zealand, it’s either illegal or newly made legal as in NSW. There will be a lot of getting used to in Australia, I expect.
See the California Highway Patrol website for the law. https://www.chp.ca.gov/programs-service ... ist-safety

The Assembly bill was originally passed 57-14 for motorcycles to be able to lanesplit at up to 50 mph and an overtaking speed of up to 15 mph. By the time the Senate passed the bill, it simply gave the CHP the authority to set up guidelines.
"
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Post by Johny » Fri, 21 Apr 2017, 23:34

That's got to be the longest post you have ever written Joseph.
Lane Splitting for motorbikes up to some speed (I think 40km/h) is now allowed in Victoria. Happened a couple of months ago.

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Post by g4qber » Sat, 22 Apr 2017, 15:15

https://practicalmotoring.com.au/voices ... t-uniform/

In Western Australia lane splitting is prohibited but not banned
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Post by TooQik » Sat, 22 Apr 2017, 15:47

I know you're not in Victoria, but I've just had a read of both the Vicroads website and the Victorian Road Safety Regulations, Lane Splitting is illegal here but Lane Filtering is okay.

Lane Splitting is defined as passing between vehicles moving at high speed.

Lane Filtering is defined as passing between stationary or slowly moving vehicles. The filtering vehicle can only travel up to 30 kmh and this rule only applies to motorcycles and scooters.

Given that the Tango won't be classified as a motorcycle I would be looking for road rules that apply to non motorcycles.

Here's a snippet from the Victorian Road Safety Regulations that's applicable, I'd look for something similar in the WA regulations:

   
   146   Driving within a single marked lane or line of traffic

   (1) A driver on a multi-lane road must drive so the driver's vehicle is completely in a marked lane, unless the driver is—

     (a) entering a part of the road of one kind from a part of the road of another kind (for example, moving to or from a service road or a shoulder of the road); or
     (b) entering or leaving the road; or
     (c) moving from one marked lane to another marked lane; or
     (d) avoiding an obstruction; or
     (e) obeying a traffic control device applying to the marked lane; or
     (f) permitted to drive in more than one marked lane under another Provision of these Rules.

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