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Johny
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Post by Johny » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:16

No suggestions just a big thanks to everyone who is devoting their time to this. I'm looking forward to it.

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Post by PlanB » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:19

Ah well it's been an interesting few years here shooting the breeze with you guys. If the forum suddenly vanishes down a rabbit hole in cyberspace at least I'll know why!

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Post by Gabz » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:23

looks like a good conversion plan. just remember to never dump the old one until your 100% the new one is working.
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Post by Peter C in Canberra » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:37

Thanks Weber and amen to all that from me. I tried the test site and it worked just fine. I also know KarlG since we are in the same branch and I am confident that he has the wherewithal and support to make the migrations work reasonably seamlessly.
I would note that the Canberra Branch passed a resolution some months ago to recognise the work put into the forums as presently hosted but also calling for them to be migrated as recommended by the webmaster who is presently KarlG.
The ACT's resolution (or an equivalent sentiment) should be put as a motion at the national level so that this can all happen.
Regards,
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Post by Mark Hemmingsen » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:42

Hi all,

I support this resolution and can confirm that the Canberra Branch is in support of it as well.

Regards,
Mark Hemmingsen - AEVA / CanberraEV president.
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Post by rhills » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 18:55

Thanks for the detailed update Weber. I'm sorry I've been AWOL on this matter, partly because of other distractions absorbing imy time and partly because I was in reactive mode, waiting to be approached about the next move.
The proposed solution sounds fine to me. While I understand peoples' enthusiasm to fix things quickly and I don't pretend to know anything about AEVA politics, I do wonder if it's worth waiting for endorsement at the national conference.
I remain happy to provide any technical support/advice I can, just ask, either here or via pm.
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Post by weber » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 19:15

Peter C in Canberra wrote: Thanks Weber and amen to all that from me. I tried the test site and it worked just fine. I also know KarlG since we are in the same branch and I am confident that he has the wherewithal and support to make the migrations work reasonably seamlessly.
I would note that the Canberra Branch passed a resolution some months ago to recognise the work put into the forums as presently hosted but also calling for them to be migrated as recommended by the webmaster who is presently KarlG.
Thanks for that, Peter, and others.
The ACT's resolution (or an equivalent sentiment) should be put as a motion at the national level so that this can all happen.

That would be nice, but in-as-far-as this is only a test, I really don't think it need delay us any further. Karl only has a small window of time available to do this. He cannot continue as webmaster after the AGM due to family, work and study committments.

But if the test is successful it would seem crazy to then go back to the WebWiz forum and have to do this all over again (costing $200 to $300 a time).

One might claim that the decision to make the change permanent should go to the national council, but if the test meets the requirements of:
no loss of content or structure,
no loss of _access_ to content,
and all existing subscribers still subscribed,
and it costs the national body nothing,

then it amounts to a purely technical decision about what software should be used to do the behind-the-scenes magic.

If the elected webmaster can't make a decision like that, why do we bother to have an elected webmaster?

I don't want to see this delayed for another 5 months.
Last edited by weber on Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 08:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by weber » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 19:28

Another reason to get this over with _before_ the AGM is to make it more likely that someone will come forward and volunteer to be our new Webmaster, as they will then know whether they will have to deal with a WebWiz forum on a Windows server in someone else's private residence, or a phpBB forum on a commercially hosted Linux server.
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Peter C in Canberra
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Post by Peter C in Canberra » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 19:33

weber wrote:
Peter C in Canberra wrote: Thanks Weber and amen to all that from me. I tried the test site and it worked just fine. I also know KarlG since we are in the same branch and I am confident that he has the wherewithal and support to make the migrations work reasonably seamlessly.
I would note that the Canberra Branch passed a resolution some months ago to recognise the work put into the forums as presently hosted but also calling for them to be migrated as recommended by the webmaster who is presently KarlG.
Thanks for that, Peter, and others.
The ACT's resolution (or an equivalent sentiment) should be put as a motion at the national level so that this can all happen.

That would be nice, but in-as-far-as this is only a test, I really don't think it need delay us any further. Karl only has a small window of time available to do this. He cannot continue as webmaster after the AGM due to family, work and study committments.

But if the test is successful it would seem crazy to then go back to the WebWiz forum and have to do this all over again (costing $200 to $300 a time).

One might claim that the decision to make the change permanent should go to the national council, but if the test meets the requirements of:
no loss of content or structure,
no loss of _access_ to content,
and all existing subscribers still subscribed,
and it costs the national body nothing,

then it amounts to a purely technical decision about what software should be used to do the behind-the-scenes magic.

If the elected webmaster can't make a decision like that, why do we bother to have an elected webmaster?

I don't want to see this delayed for another 5 months.


Yep, I'm happy with that too. I was only suggesting the resolution if it seemed that is what it would take to have it take place. Go for it I say.
Peter.
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Post by woody » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 19:39

From memory the Sydney resolution was that the features were all there and the content was migrated. Content includes:
Topics
Posts
Users/Passwords/profiles
Images
Attachments/Uploads
External Links
Internal Links (harder)
Private Messages (ideally)

Ideally the links (e.g. in forum emails) would redirect to the new forum topic + post.

An easier option is to just get the existing forum hosted by the WebWiz people:

https://www.webwiz.co.uk/web-wiz-forums ... osting.htm

from $8.22/month.
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weber
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Post by weber » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 20:10

woody wrote: From memory the Sydney resolution was that the features were all there and the content was migrated. Content includes:
Topics
Posts
Users/Passwords/profiles
Images
Attachments/Uploads
External Links
Internal Links (harder)
Private Messages (ideally)

Ideally the links (e.g. in forum emails) would redirect to the new forum topic + post.
gConverter tell us they can do all of those except the passwords (as I mentioned earlier). No one can read the passwords*, which, if you think about it, is as it should be.
An easier option is to just get the existing forum hosted by the WebWiz people:

https://www.webwiz.co.uk/web-wiz-forums ... osting.htm

from $8.22/month.
We thought long and hard about that, but it has three disadvantages:
(a) they are on the opposite side of the planet (in the UK), so we may not get as snappy a response as we would from an Aussie server,
(b) using the Aussie server that the AEVA website is on will not cost any extra, whereas the UK WebWiz server will probably cost around $200 a year for the level of service we'd need,
(c) it would not address the need to have the forum know who is an AEVA member and who is not. Not to punish non-members, but to reward members (for their $40 a year).

*Except maybe the NSA. Image

[Edit] The Aussie hosting service the AEVA is already using is https://ventraip.com.au/web-hosting/
Last edited by weber on Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 09:23, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by karlg » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 20:23

I agree with weber's listed disadvantages and would like to add:

(d) We live in a post-Snowden era, and should make sure that any laws governing our data are only Australian laws.

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Post by weber » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 20:49

One of the things that clinched it for me, that phpBB was going to do the job, was when I wanted to ensure that our embedded YouTube videos would still work. There was no [ TUBE ]...[ /TUBE ] BBcode in phpBB. I'm guessing this is something Andrew gave us. Good work Andrew! So I looked at the HTML generated by this WebWiz forum, for one my posts containing a video, and was able to add an identical [ TUBE ]...[ /TUBE ] BBCode to phpBB with a few keystrokes.

Not sure if you can see this test.
http://aeva.asn.au/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2
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Post by Adverse Effects » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 21:23

even tho i realy have no rights to say yes or no (non financial member) but i can say thank you for all your hard work you have done and that you are about to dive head first in to

[EDIT] yes the youtubes worked
Last edited by Adverse Effects on Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 10:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by karlg » Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 22:30

It's always a good time to sign up and join the club!
Image


http://www.aeva.asn.au/content/membership

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Adverse Effects
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Post by Adverse Effects » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 00:15

lol i can only just afford my gas guzzler

if i had a EV or could afford to build a EV i would singh up in a sec Image

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Post by Peter C in Canberra » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 02:30

Adverse Effects wrote: lol i can only just afford my gas guzzler

if i had a EV or could afford to build a EV i would singh up in a sec Image

A 2010 iMiEV with low milage on carsales.com.au for $16-18K? Building one as good would cost more. If there is not one locally you can get it trucked to you for a few $100.
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Post by Adverse Effects » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 03:35

lol dude you think i would be paying $150 for every 500Km i do it i could afford a $16K to $18K EV?

i'm one of the poor unwashed masses
Last edited by Adverse Effects on Thu, 16 Oct 2014, 16:36, edited 1 time in total.

Peter C in Canberra
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Post by Peter C in Canberra » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 04:03

Adverse Effects wrote: lol dude you think i would be paying $150 for every 500Km i do it i could afford a $16K to $18K EV?

i'm one of the poor unwashed masses

I only mentioned it in case you thought it would cost you a lot more than that. Many people think EVs are much more expensive.
$20l/100km? I am sure there are more efficient cheap old cars, like what I drove before 1) I had a bit more money and 2) got into EVs.
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Post by Peter C in Canberra » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 14:59

Sorry for the diversion off topic.
So, can we assume the trial migration is all happening now, and if it works, that we will stick with that?
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Post by Gabz » Fri, 17 Oct 2014, 15:28

woody wrote:
An easier option is to just get the existing forum hosted by the WebWiz people:

https://www.webwiz.co.uk/web-wiz-forums ... osting.htm

from $8.22/month.


I would call this a waste of money since we already are paying for hosting with the current provider.
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Post by weber » Sat, 18 Oct 2014, 18:44

Thanks for the kind words, Adverse. Sorry you got badgered. Image Your kind words should also be understood as thanking Andrew for the much greater amount of hard work he has done over the years to keep this forum going.
Peter C in Canberra wrote: Sorry for the diversion off topic.
So, can we assume the trial migration is all happening now, and if it works, that we will stick with that?

Nothing can happen until we hear from Andrew. Andrew previously gave Karl an admin password to the WebWiz forum, and an FTP password so he could copy files, but gConverter also need the password to the Microsoft-Access database that stores most of the data for the forum.

Karl emailed Andrew yesterday morning, requesting this password, and has had no reply.

acmotor, do you know if Andrew is away or unable to read forum or email for some reason?
Last edited by weber on Sat, 18 Oct 2014, 07:46, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Andrew » Sat, 18 Oct 2014, 20:31

It's great to see so much enthusiasm towards the AEVA forums and an ongoing pressure to keep things updated! The success of the current forum software and hosting platform speaks for itself, as it has now been live and operational for the past 7 years or so, now with over 50,000 posts.

For those who really want to know, I have provided an FTP access account to the forum database for Karl quite some time ago. However, it may be easier for Karl to take a copy (at this stage for experimental purposes) off Dropbox. Such access has been set up and does not touch the active database at all (I emphasize the word COPY).

Despite all the keyboard warriors on here, I am willing continue to keep these forums alive until the change of platform has been tested, proven and operational.

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Post by Adverse Effects » Sat, 18 Oct 2014, 23:36

weber wrote: Thanks for the kind words, Adverse. Sorry you got badgered. Image Your kind words should also be understood as thanking Andrew for the much greater amount of hard work he has done over the years to keep this forum going.
its all good i have thick skin and have been bagged worse lol

you are correct a big part of that thanks is/was for Andrew

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Post by weber » Sun, 19 Oct 2014, 23:31

Andrew wrote:I have provided an FTP access account to the forum database for Karl quite some time ago. However, it may be easier for Karl to take a copy (at this stage for experimental purposes) off Dropbox. Such access has been set up and does not touch the active database at all (I emphasize the word COPY).

Thanks Andrew.

Just to let everyone know what's happening: Rob Hills is currently using the snapshot provided by Andrew, to investigate the feasibility of doing the conversion himself, with the help of some free scripts.

Both Rob and gConverter have indicated that there is a possibility that
PMs (private messages) may not be convertible
Presumably this would be due to either the source or destination forum encrypting them. This is the same reason passwords cannot be converted. So I would encourage you to go to your Member Control Panel, then Private Messenger, and look in your Inbox and Outbox for any private messages you can't bear to lose. When you open a message you will find a link at the bottom that says "Email this Private Message to myself". Unfortunately this can only be done one message at a time.

The earliest that the forum could be locked, for what could potentially be the final conversion, would be Tuesday morning (more likely Wednesday or Thursday). gConverter have an option where we pay 20% extra and they do their own test conversion first, which may take 2 to 3 days, during which time the forum can remain active. Then they only need to lock the forum for about 6 hours to do the final conversion. If we go with gConverter we will pay for that option, and we will pay for the option where they try to convert the PMs.
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