Ultra Batteries

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gttool
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Post by gttool »

does anyone know anything about thes batteries developed by the CSIRO
link to an article
http://www.manmonthly.com.au/articles/U ... 238484.htm

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Post by Benonymous »

It looks like there will be a useful (not startling) reduction in price but there's still lead in them batts. If they could get them to market for an equivalent price to current FLA or SLA batteries that'd be better news.
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Post by antiscab »

Theyre just caps and SLA's.

power density marginally better than high rate batteries such as the optima yellow tops (until the cap depletes).
bad energy density (worse than 'normal' lead due to the cap weight)
charge acceptance is just as good as an optima.

y would you bother.

Matt
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Richo
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Post by Richo »

people are deperate Image

Personally I would prefer a flow cell.
So the short answer is NO but the long answer is YES.
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AMPrentice
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Post by AMPrentice »

CSIRO need to find a way to get rid of the lead Image
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Richo
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Post by Richo »

Mmmm flowcell - no lead.
So the short answer is NO but the long answer is YES.
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Post by AMPrentice »

Richo wrote: Mmmm flowcell - no lead.


Can we get them smaller than for a military application?!! Image

I heard they where huge at the moment and where trying to make a v2 of the Vfuel or v3 will be small enough I cant remember?.

They are $500USD per KW hour

so how many KW hour do we need for most applications going 100km and also what size and weight will thing be?
Last edited by AMPrentice on Thu, 23 Oct 2008, 05:54, edited 1 time in total.
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Richo
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Post by Richo »

None suitable comercially for an eV yet...
As far as I'm aware there is some research going on here in WA.
hopefully not too far away.

Actually most available are for solar storage / power levelling.
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Post by woody »

AMPrentice wrote:
They are $500USD per KW hour

so how many KW hour do we need for most applications going 100km and also what size and weight will thing be?
1 litre of petrol has almost 10kWh of energy, but most of that is wasted in a car. The general rule is 2 kWh will get you the same distance as 1 litre of petrol. e.g. your 10L/100km car will need 20kWh for 100km = US$10,000. = AU$15K.

How heavy, I don't know for flow batteries.

For a Lead example: 20AH greensavers are good for about 140Wh each (20AH x 12V x 60%DoD) and weigh 7kg = 20Wh/kg i.e. 20kWh = 1000kg (ouch) + AU$60 x 142 = AU$8,500 (reasonable)

LiFePO4 example: TS90s are 3kg and 90 x 80% DoD x 3v = 216Wh each i.e. 72Wh/kg i.e. 20kWh = 278kg (reasonable) = US$12,500 (ouch)

So if the price holds whilst they make the smaller then they are looking OK

cheers,
Woody
Planned EV: '63 Cortina using AC and LiFePO4 Battery Pack
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Post by AMPrentice »

thank you Woody, it looks like lipo is the only choice then even for 50per cent more price. Problem is quality of cells. I fear that we get second quality and first quality goes towards locally made ev companies that pester them till they cough. .

Its a shame greensavers are so heavy! Image

Even with 14.4kwhr pack my 600kg trike will struggle for 80km with a rider acting like a parachute. Image
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Post by juk »

"CSIRO need to find a way to get rid of the lead"

Esperance port seems to be a popular option :p
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Post by Richo »

Too may failed eV boats I suspect Image
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Post by AMPrentice »

Richo wrote: Too may failed eV boats I suspect Image


Image
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Post by EVLearner »

I contacted the CSIRO today to confirm that they had developed a production model of the UltraBattery with the Furukawa Battery Company in Japan - and they had, but apparently nothing has happened in Australia as no Australian battery company has raised its hand to work with the CSIRO - and that is a crazy pity!

Sure, they need to remove the heavy metal if they can - but the concept is brilliant as it leads to a whole new way to radically extend the life and maximumise the AH rating of batteries as we know them, and/or make them significantly smaller/lighter.

Do we have any Ministers that need to be lobbied so that they can champion the direction and get Australian battery companies to develop production lines in Australia?

We could then export cars: "Batteries Included"!
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Post by jackhyq »

don't know this.
Portable AC/DC/Solar UPS;
3D BirdView,RearView,A.I System;
1C~90C LFP/LiPo Battery ;
BatteryShow@126.Com;
www.Ponilion.Com
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Post by EVLearner »

Last week I saw a twist on the UltraBattery development! This Website http://powerelectronics.com/portable_po ... ries-0502/ conatined a new article that goes another step towards getting rid of as large amount of the Lead out of the Lead-Acid Battery - and replacing it with Carbon (at a far lower density and much stronger structure and therefore life span - and more suitable for EVs.

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