Blade EV - New model

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Blade EV - New model

Post by photomac » Tue, 16 Nov 2010, 18:47

Thought this exciting (competition to th Nissan LEAF)

from
http://bev.com.au/

----------------
COMING SOON:
ALL NEW BLADE RUNNER

Announcing Australia’s first plug-in EV with a range of 240km (based on the Japanese 10.15 drive cycle) and 180km of highway driving.

It will be Australia’s first EV powered by a 100% Australian designed and built drive train (taking local content over 80%) AND the first practical EV for driving in regional areas. We call it the Blade Runner.

It comes with a four-on-the-floor semi-automatic shift for those who like to DRIVE their car. Available mid-2011.

----------
Based on Hyundai i20 it seems
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Blade EV - New model

Post by Johny » Tue, 16 Nov 2010, 19:04

Where is he getting the motor controller? He says it's all Australian. Is that yours TJ?

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Post by markrmarkr » Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 19:52

I too would like to know which motor and controller are being used. If it's Australian there are not many options other than Tritium are there?

Using a modern glider I'd think CAN integration would be a big advantage for Tritium too.
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Post by coulomb » Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 20:28

Looks like it might be two seater only; sacrificing the back seats to get the 240k (Jap 10.15) or 180k (highway) range.

Image

Or maybe you'll get the choice later, as with the Electron Mark V (lower range 5 door) or V+ (higher range 3 door).
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Post by EV2Go » Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 20:41

Read the fine print people...

It will be Australia’s first EV powered by a 100% Australian designed and built DRIVE TRAIN (taking local content over 80%) AND the first practical EV for driving in regional areas. We call it the Blade Runner.

There is no motor or controller in a drive train, only bits that put power to the wheels.

100% Australian designed and built POWER TRAIN would be a whole different matter.

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Post by gmacd33 » Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 22:47

So if it's not referring to the motor or controller, then it must be the transmission, differential, drive shaft etc? My understanding is that those parts come from a Hyundai Getz, which is not made in Australia?!?

Not to mention the fact that many people use the term DRIVE TRAIN to mean the same as POWER TRAIN - check out wiki:drivetrain or yahoo answers. After all the motor/controller is used to DRIVE the vehicle. Even if the two are technically different, it is still very misleading.

It even says "POWERED by a ... drive train"
Last edited by gmacd33 on Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 11:55, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by coulomb » Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 23:12

bev.com.au wrote: It will be Australia’s first EV powered by a 100% Australian designed and built drive train (taking local content over 80%)

I wonder about the 80% local content.
Do they count the local research and development as a huge component?
Perhaps they count the battery (perhaps a third of the cost of the vehicle) as one item, the same as the heater hose clip sourced from Bunnings as one item?
[ Edit: Perhaps the battery isn't part of the drive train by their definition, and they are claiming that a local controller and motor bring the local content of the drive train (on its own, separate from the body etc) to 80%? ]

I guess we'll have to wait and see the detail.

Last edited by coulomb on Fri, 18 Feb 2011, 12:14, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Adverse Effects » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 04:32

coulomb wrote:I wonder about the 80% local content.


"The Blade Electron is specifically designed to be serviced and maintained by any licensed Auto Electrician, and contains 55% local content."

hmm its going down

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Post by coulomb » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 05:16

Adverse Effects wrote:"The Blade Electron is specifically designed to be serviced and maintained by any licensed Auto Electrician, and contains 55% local content."

hmm its going down

That's for the Electron Mark V model, based on the Getz. The new Blade Runner model, based on the Hyundai i20, is claimed to be over 80% local content.
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Post by Electrocycle » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 14:17

the content percentage is probably based on the dollar value of the parts.

ie the "glider" costs about 20% of the finished car.
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Post by coulomb » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 15:36

Sigh. Duplicate post.
Last edited by coulomb on Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 04:38, edited 1 time in total.
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Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by coulomb » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 15:37

Electrocycle wrote: the content percentage is probably based on the dollar value of the parts.

That's what I thought first, and expect.

But then... Australian made battery pack? Lead acid perhaps?

Image
Last edited by coulomb on Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 04:39, edited 1 time in total.
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5650 W solar, 2xPIP-4048MS inverters, 16 kWh battery.
1.4 kW solar with 1.2 kW Latronics inverter and FIT.
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Patching PIP-4048/5048 inverter-chargers.

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Post by Electrocycle » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 17:16

made in australia from imported parts? :P
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Post by lithbattboss » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 18:43

A large part of the car is Australian product since all of the steel Hyundai uses to make their cars comes from 100% iron ore mined in Australia.
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Post by T1 Terry » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 20:12

80% Australian made from local and imported ingredients Image

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Post by woody » Sat, 19 Feb 2011, 20:54

Giving blade the benefit of the doubt - they are probably using an Australian built or modified gearbox. We still make them here...
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Post by marcopolo » Mon, 21 Feb 2011, 07:19

Electrocycle wrote: made in Australia from imported parts? :P


The term is a little misleading. In fact the Australian motor industry has always been dependant on a very complex formula to determine what is local content.

Like all Blade products, the Blade Runner's local content is measured by the same formula as Holden, Ford and Toyota.

So, who will put their money where their mouth is, and buy one? Or, just like the Electron mark 5, will nearly all the sales be made in NZ?

Why not ask your 'green' politician, Federal, State and local government what they're driving?

You have an opportunity to help an Australian EV pioneer. Or shall once again we apathetically watch an overseas product displace the local, through a lack of support by Australians?

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Post by EV2Go » Mon, 21 Feb 2011, 17:43

Firstly I’m not saying that I wouldn't buy one if I wanted a pre made EV (I'm not saying I would either) but for me I struggle to see this as more than a sophisticated conversion.

All the panels are new and it hasn’t done any kms, but I really struggle to see this as an Australian built car.

Much in the same vein that I have a problem with Holden producing a Commodore and Toyota putting Lexan badges on it and calling it a Toyota (or any of the numerous other examples of the same thing out there).

I commend them in trying to break into the big boy territory, but until they are producing their own designs and body panels, I’m sorry but I still see it as a conversion.

I wish them well in trying to crack it in the big time. Just curious but what is the car manufactured as a Blade or a Hyundai on the compliance plates?

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Post by marcopolo » Mon, 21 Feb 2011, 18:53

EV2Go wrote: All the panels are new and it hasn’t done any kms, but I really struggle to see this as an Australian built car.

I commend them in trying to break into the big boy territory, but until they are producing their own designs and body panels, I’m sorry but I still see it as a conversion.


Well, in that case you would find it very difficult to accredit any car as being "Australian made"! Neither GM-Holden's Commodore, nor the Ford Falcon are, or were ever truly Australian, just adaptations of either the European or US versions. As for body panels, the cost of producing cosmetically different body panels would be pointlessly expensive and costly for the driver to repair, adding to the purchase cost of the vehicle and insurance.

Most smaller marques have traditionally been largely someone else's chassis or drive train. Would you say that a Morgan is just a Ford? A Jensen, really a Chrysler. Tesla, a lotus? Chrysler 300c a Mercedes?   

The Blade Electron enjoys the same 'Australian Made' status as the Commodore, Aurion and Falcon!

The compliance Plate is Blade. The VIN is Blade.

But it's catch 22, not enough sales to justify unique design, and no unique design without sales!

Phew... that's a relief! That's another reason to ignore the local product.

The actual cost of owning and operating a Blade can be as low as $4.00 per day.

Is there anyone out there who would like to help save the planet, for less than $4.00 per day? Anyone..Anyone...? (sigh)   


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Post by lithbattboss » Mon, 21 Feb 2011, 18:57

EV2Go wrote:I commend them in trying to break into the big boy territory, but until they are producing their own designs and body panels, I’m sorry but I still see it as a conversion.

I wish them well in trying to crack it in the big time. Just curious but what is the car manufactured as a Blade or a Hyundai on the compliance plates?

From talking to two of the "big boys" (professionals in the industry with many years experience of working for Ford and GM- both in Australia and the USA) I can tell you they will never crack the big time. Their cars have several quality issues with them and they are built to nowhere near the quality standards of a car built by the big boy's.
Two of these "big boys" have personally inspected the Blade workshop/assembly plant and there are several "issues" so they are well qualified to comment on Blade's vehicles.

If you were to closely inspect the build quality of an EV from Blade and an EV from one of the big boys it is easy to see the quality differences. In addition, speaking personally from my area of expertise regarding batteries, you will never see any of the big boys use TS or CALB batteries in their professional EV designs. I recall the moment last year when I asked them personally (face to face) if they had considered using Thundersky batteries and to put it plainly they looked at me shaking their heads in disbelief with the look on their faces saying "are you serious".

There will be several EV's in Australia which will be conversions of existing models and converted from ICE to EV by some of these big players in the EV industry. One of these EV conversions which I saw recently is an EV engineering masterpiece. The cost of the custom manufactured motor/controller alone (which was manufactured in the USA) cost more than the entire cost for an EV conversion undertaken by most enthusiasts on this forum.

Due to confidentiality I am not permitted to speak in detail about any of these EV's or post any photos but I understand ABC TV is filming a documentary on EV's in Australia and this conversion will be filmed for the TV special.

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Post by EV2Go » Mon, 21 Feb 2011, 21:54

The more I think about the more credit I think needs to be given to BEV. It really is a David and Goliath type fight.

Now that is either really really stupid or they have some serious guts to give it a go. I personally can’t see them cracking the big time, no more than I could see David winning, but I guess time will tell.

Also on the flip side I guess while they are managing to carve out a living, they are doing as well as most out. So really it is a win / win for them. Power to them I say.

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Post by marcopolo » Tue, 22 Feb 2011, 03:53

lithbattboss wrote: From talking to two of the "big boys" (professionals in the industry with many years experience of working for Ford and GM- both in Australia and the USA) I can tell you they will never crack the big time. Their cars have several quality issues with them and they are built to nowhere near the quality standards of a car built by the big boy's.Two of these "big boys" have personally inspected the Blade workshop/assembly plant and there are several "issues" so they are well qualified to comment on Blade's vehicles.
Let me see, you met a couple of unnamed employees of a couple of "big boys who shook their heads in despair at Blade Quality?

That's it? That's your source of Authority?

Well, I don't agree. I have no "issues" with Blades quality, but I have several "issues" over the years with both Ford and GM quality control. (gee, that me and several hundred thousand other owners over the years)

As for your GM guys, thats very odd, because one of GM's brightest engineers works for Blade. (And still contracts to GM). I demonstrated my Blade Electron 5 to Edsel Ford, and he was most complimentary about the remarkable achievement of Blade and the little Electron. (but what would he know? he's just the former President of Ford Australia and a director of Ford Motor Company).

Blade is based on the Hyundai Getz glider. The Getz has won so many motoring awards and is the durable car of choice for the majority of rental firms.
If you were to closely inspect the build quality of an EV from Blade and an EV from one of the big boys it is easy to see the quality differences.


Wow, thats amazing! Tell me, which of the amazing machines is on sale in Australia? That's right, NONE! The Leaf, and iMev have only just arrived here in Australia as publicity demonstrators. The GM Volt will one day be produced in RHD, and the Ford focus is yet to be released. So there is actually no Ford EV in Australia, or the US for your mythical Ford guys to be experts about!

Blade Has being SELLING EV's for four years!

I have driven all the above vehicles and the imev is not superior to the Blade, just a lot more expensive. The Leaf is an excellent EV, and if Nissan promote it properly it's real competition to the current model Volt. The Volt is the best of all, but a totally different class of vehicle.
One of these EV conversions which I saw recently is an EV engineering masterpiece. The cost of the custom manufactured motor/controller alone (which was manufactured in the USA) cost more than the entire cost for an EV conversion undertaken by most enthusiasts on this forum.
Now you have wandered off into the realm of irrelevant fantasy.
Due to confidentiality I am not permitted to speak in detail about any of these EV's or post any photos but I understand ABC TV is filming a documentary on EV's in Australia and this conversion will be filmed for the TV special.
Of course you can't! This would compromise your unnamed, but highly knowledgeable sources! Maybe we will see you 'round the ABC studio's, you be the one with the false moustache and trench coat.

No matter what ever anyone achieves, there always some pub/armchair know-it-all with some malicious story, about some bloke he met, whose names he can't divulge, (because they're too important), who can prove that guy who has actually done something, is really no good!!

Here's a thought, why don't you simply do some honest research. Go and buy/build an EV. Go and visit Blade and report for your self.

Actually, do something positive, instead of trying to big note yourself at the expense of others.




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Post by lithbattboss » Tue, 22 Feb 2011, 04:41

Marcopolo, I am not here to tell lies. Everything I say is the truth and you will see this over the coming months as this information comes to light. It is frustrating not being able to talk in detail about some of these fascinating projects since I am sure many forum members would be extremely interested to hear about these developments.
You clearly have a poor understanding of how large businesses operate if you don't fully understand the requirement to sign confidentiality agreements as demanded by these companies when you are involved with them on their projects or know information about their latest developments which are not yet in the public domain. I have no control over this when working with such companies and must abide by their rules just as if I was working for your company I am sure you would want me to abide by your companies rules also. Believe me, you will hear lots more over the next 12 months regarding these EV projects. All I can say it is good to see some things happening in Australia even if it is happening slowly.
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Post by lithbattboss » Tue, 22 Feb 2011, 04:52

marcopolo wrote: So there is actually no Ford EV in Australia, or the US for your mythical Ford guys to be experts about!

Really now...are you sure about this? How much would you like to bet on this?
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Post by marcopolo » Tue, 22 Feb 2011, 07:12

lithbattboss wrote: Marcopolo, I am not here to tell lies. Everything I say is the truth and you will see this over the coming months as this information comes to light. It is frustrating not being able to talk in detail about some of these fascinating projects since I am sure many forum members would be extremely interested to hear about these developments.
I don't wish to be unkind. But, here the thing. If you can't say anything, don't!

Otherwise you run the risk of everyone thinking you are just a wanker!You must realise that from time to time, these forums attract wankers, who appear, claim to be about to reveal amazing developments, only to disappear when challenged. So perhaps you will forgive a certain cynicism?

Much better to wait until you can speak with authority, citing the sources of your revelations. In addition you can enjoy the satisfaction of watching others, like me, rant on inaccurately, while you know the real story!

I'm sure everyone can't wait to hear learn of these amazing developments.

In the meantime, yes I meant Ford EV's on sale in Australia and the US. The Focus is in pre-production with demonstrators now scheduled for release in August. in the US, Ford also build the Ford EV Transit Connect Van, and a variety of specialist commercial vehicles. Ford also built an EV Ranger and a Hybrid Escape.

William Clay Ford Jr, drove an EV ranger, and has been a an EV advocate for EV 25 years. Had it not been for Bill Ford, Smith Electric vehicles would have disappeared.

But none of these vehicles are on sale in Australia, today.

But the Blade is on sale, and can actually be purchased and driven home. Just like its donor car, it's designed to be reliable commuter transport. I have driven from Melbourne to Healsville,and back (via the Yarra valley vineyards), recharging the Electron only once. ( but me, several times!).

Of course it's not as comfortable as my Lexus 450h Hybrid, very few cars are, but it's certainly not difficult or tiring to drive. In it's true element as a city commuter, it performs extremely well. I have also driven Melbourne to Geelong and back, recharging only once.

The point is, it's affordable, user friendly, financially viable and available. Like most vehicles each model is an improvement on the vehicle it supersedes. as a fleet buyer, I hope the new Blade Runner will compete with the Leaf, as I want to continue buying Australian.   


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